# Digital sources are the worst and most confusing part and about hifi audio **URL:** \ **Category:** Network Audio\ **Created:** [July 2, 2020, 10:07pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793 "2020-07-02T22:07:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![scotte1](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forum.psaudio.com/scotte1/32/147_2.png) [@scotte1](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/scotte1)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2020, 2:30pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/21 "2020-07-03T14:30:20Z")
“Roon Radio”, I believe. Two software upgrades or so ago, this feature really came into its own – a wonderful tool to explore new music and enjoy background music without any fussing. I like to cue up a favorite track, and let Roon Radio take if from there, from time to time. When I discover something new to me that I really enjoy, I add it to my Roon library and mark it down for purchasing it “physically” later (as I like to own physical copies of my favorite music as much as possible). ---
**Author:** ![brett66](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forum.psaudio.com/brett66/32/92201_2.png) [@brett66](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/brett66)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2020, 2:54pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/22 "2020-07-03T14:54:04Z")
Algorithm is the word you’re searching… ---
**Author:** ![Elk](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forum.psaudio.com/elk/32/1240_2.png) [@Elk](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/Elk)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2020, 3:20pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/23 "2020-07-03T15:20:22Z")
No problem, I was merely intrigued by the word in this context. It sounds like it works well for a number here. ---
**Author:** ![jazzbirder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e0b2c6/32.png) [@jazzbirder](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/jazzbirder)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2020, 3:23pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/24 "2020-07-03T15:23:07Z")
I was just about to buy the Zenith MKIII, then I started to do research in a Dutch company called Magna Hifi ! The company offers a streamer called the Nano ULTRA. This streamer is connected to my P S Aucio Direct Stream DAC via I2S, and the input is connected via an ethernet cable to my cable router which will end up connected to my Dell desktop computer. There are some reviews in the European audio websites. The streamer only costs about $1230 for the US version ! ---
**Author:** ![aangen](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forum.psaudio.com/aangen/32/295709_2.png) [@aangen](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/aangen)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2020, 4:22pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/25 "2020-07-03T16:22:43Z")
I could not find anything with Google on the Nano Ultra. That is a very common product name though. Fun. ---
**Author:** ![kerosene](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forum.psaudio.com/kerosene/32/9084_2.png) [@kerosene](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/kerosene)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2020, 4:28pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/26 "2020-07-03T16:28:26Z")
I agree with the topic of this thread. I also wonder if USB audio will be around in a decade. ---
**Author:** ![scotte1](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forum.psaudio.com/scotte1/32/147_2.png) [@scotte1](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/scotte1)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2020, 4:42pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/27 "2020-07-03T16:42:12Z")
> [@aangen](#): > > I could not find anything with Google on the Nano Ultra. Its out there – just go to the Magna HiFi web page first and then find the directory/drop down for ordering kit on line. I am not a streamer aficionado. That said, I reviewed the product details and was decidedly non plussed. Cheers. ---
**Author:** ![jvvita](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e56c9b/32.png) [@jvvita](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/jvvita)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2020, 5:04pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/28 "2020-07-03T17:04:25Z")
And the correct product name is Mano Ultra [https://www.magnahifi.com/en/webshop/mano-ultra](https://www.magnahifi.com/en/webshop/mano-ultra) ---
**Author:** ![Elk](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forum.psaudio.com/elk/32/1240_2.png) [@Elk](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/Elk)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2020, 5:11pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/29 "2020-07-03T17:11:30Z")
USB audio will likely be around, but in an industry standard form adopting connectors which are a single size, can be inserted either way, and the equipment will set itself up automatically to communicate with to whatever it is connected. Of course, this could be a format other than USB, but given how USB is otherwise ubiquitous this is my guess. ---
**Author:** ![kerosene](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forum.psaudio.com/kerosene/32/9084_2.png) [@kerosene](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/kerosene)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2020, 7:57pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/30 "2020-07-03T19:57:29Z")
I remember thinking the USB to DAC model was remarkable but I was using a computer and iTunes, later Amarra. After a few years using a server/endpoint model, USB now seems dated. However, I think you’re right on about its future. Plus, USB audio has improved so dramatically and will only continue to do so. ---
**Author:** ![Elk](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forum.psaudio.com/elk/32/1240_2.png) [@Elk](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/Elk)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2020, 8:46pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/31 "2020-07-03T20:46:51Z")
Thinking of dated, Ethernet has been standardized since the 1980’s, developed the decade previously. ---
**Author:** ![kerosene](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forum.psaudio.com/kerosene/32/9084_2.png) [@kerosene](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/kerosene)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2020, 9:10pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/32 "2020-07-03T21:10:46Z")
![xeroxparc](https://us1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/uploads/psaudio/original/3X/e/7/e72323b55c7079ee379d3e976b92d19583ef4199.png) ---
**Author:** ![joma0711](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forum.psaudio.com/joma0711/32/277666_2.png) [@joma0711](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/joma0711)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2020, 9:37pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/33 "2020-07-03T21:37:09Z")
aye and it still works a treat 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![2chan4ever](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/2/eb9ed0/32.png) [@2chan4ever](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/2chan4ever)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 6:00am UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/34 "2020-07-04T06:00:01Z")
First of all Digital is highly confusing. Luckily we have Ted to demystify it 🙂 Now, I really do not dig paying hundreds, thousands for music I do not own the rights to. Anything can happen. Poof, my music is gone and so is my investment. This really drives people to piracy. I won’t go there but it makes it tempting. Why can’t they just sell us the music? Like they sold us cd’s? I know why. There is way more money in it for them. It is unfair. I do think certain companies, even Itunes let you download it locally. Certainly soundcloud. You can keep Roon. A lot of money for nothing. Right now I have digital that does not jive and waiting for an Engineer. ---
**Author:** ![speed-racer](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forum.psaudio.com/speed-racer/32/115653_2.png) [@speed-racer](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/speed-racer)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 6:26am UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/35 "2020-07-04T06:26:50Z")
My issue with the Magna Mano Ultra is that the I2S output is limited to DSD64. That is a show stopper as I need it to support DSD256 as the DirectStream with support that soon. ---
**Author:** ![Paul](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forum.psaudio.com/paul/32/6_2.png) [@Paul](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/Paul)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 12:18pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/36 "2020-07-04T12:18:07Z")
That’s part of the problem. The musicians make next to nothing off of streaming. It’s one of the reasons we started Octave Records, to help support musicians. I recall my musician friend, Dan Schwartz, who framed his first royalty check from Spotify. $0.01 was the amount on the check. Streaming works for us listeners. It’s great! But, for the average musician, it doesn’t work at all. ---
**Author:** ![Elk](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forum.psaudio.com/elk/32/1240_2.png) [@Elk](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/Elk)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 12:49pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/37 "2020-07-04T12:49:28Z")
Tidal, paying one the highest rates to musicians, pays performers $0.01284 per stream. ---
**Author:** ![Photon46](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forum.psaudio.com/photon46/32/142920_2.png) [@Photon46](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/Photon46)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 1:04pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/38 "2020-07-04T13:04:48Z")
Streaming audio has been an utter financial disaster for the vast majority of artists. I’ve read editorials rationalizing the replacement of hard copy royalties with streaming royalties by talking about how much Taylor Swift earns but that’s so disingenuous and isn’t representative of reality for most performers. Most musicians would starve if it weren’t for the income from live performances. Stevie Nicks was interviewed about the reason she doesn’t think Fleetwood Mac will ever release another recording and it boils down to the fact almost no one will pay for music anymore. They can spend a year in the studio working on a recording very few will pay for anymore or they can go on the road and make a good living. New artists don’t have the option of sitting on their creative laurels and milking the same cow over and over so figuring out how to make a living is even more precarious for them. We can rationalize the replacement of owning music with streaming all we want but the technology as currently implemented is extremely exploitative of musical artists. ---
**Author:** ![joma0711](https://sea1.discourse-cdn.com/flex015/user_avatar/forum.psaudio.com/joma0711/32/277666_2.png) [@joma0711](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/joma0711)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 1:07pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/39 "2020-07-04T13:07:50Z")
This is why Bandcamp is such a good platform. Streaming sucks (from online sources) sucks. ---
**Author:** ![DuneKidd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/41988e/32.png) [@DuneKidd](https://forum.psaudio.com/u/DuneKidd)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2020, 2:38pm UTC](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793/40 "2020-07-04T14:38:58Z")
Thanks for the great information… I too, am new to this “digital arena” of streaming, and don’t particularly care for ripping off artists in the manner that Tidal, Roon and the rest seem to find perfectly acceptable. Can’t wait to really dig into that site. [Previous page](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793.md?page=1) [Next page](https://forum.psaudio.com/t/digital-sources-are-the-worst-and-most-confusing-part-and-about-hifi-audio/17793.md?page=3)