Active speakers, anno 2020

D&D is very attractive, apparently sounds great and the price is also good. They’ve been promising Roon for a while, there is beta software available, but it’s not certified yet.

The Makua is probably excellent.

The Devialet Expert is a Swiss Army knife pre-amp. The cheapest one, the Devialet 140, was I think pared down a bit to get it to €5,000. I have a Denon DVD player connected to the screen by HDMI and the Devialet by Toslink. It is also connected to the Devialet as a transport by co-axial. My Sky satellite box is connected to the Expert by optical.

Devialet cut out the pre-out option that is in all other Expert units. This may have been to cut cost. The conspiracy theory is that they did not want people just buying it as a streaming DAC pre-amp, because at €5,000 it’s very competitive even ignoring the amplifier. Apparently for a few more € they will add the pre-amp option so you could use it with D&D. The Expert will covert DSD to 24/192.

The 140 phono amp is also pared down with fewer options. If you used it with a medium or high output cartridge you would not be disappointed at all. I have the SoundSmith Zephyr Mk3, it’s a MI cartridge 2.4mV output with ultra-light cantilever. It costs as much as some decent MC carts, but I’m delighted with it. (I have a version rebranded by Origin Live as Aladdin Mk2.)The other popular choice would be a Benz.

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The D&D are not Roon ready yet. I think it is more difficult to implement Roon over the network connection on the speakers than they thought. You do need the network connection if you want to use the DSP or receive updates to the onboard software. You can make adjustments to the speakers and remove the network connection if you want to. I still use a DAC and a preamp but neither is required if you use AES. If you do not use a preamp you will need to have the network connection to adjust volume if your playback software does not have that capability. The D&D volume control is not very well implemented and I think is primarily intended to set fixed levels. I have had my 8c’s for about 9 months or so and love them. I use a set of 32 foot long XLR’s to connect the preamp to the speakers.

I would not even consider D&D until they had Roon onboard. Roon transformed the Devialet Expert, which auto-detects a stream and switches on, Roon controls the volume and music plays. The Devialet volume control is excellent.

If I just wanted active speakers I’d have bought ATC many years ago. All-in-one boxes have to do that with nothing added.

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I use a Pink Faun 2.16x Ultra for a Roon core, music storage and server. It is an end game device.

Here’s a great discussion with Martijn Mensink from D&D in Stereophile.
Removed quote.
Article here if you want more details on the design and implementation:
https://www.stereophile.com/content/going-dutch-dutch-conversation-martijn-mensink

btw, Stereophile moved the 8cs to class A recommended for full range.

Baldy, you are a good partner four our economy!

Dutch & Dutch speakers from Rotterdam and Pink Faun from Rhenen, also in the Netherlands.

20 km from where I live.

If PS Audio added a Phono stage (balanced inputs please) and upgraded the DAC of the Stellar Gain Cell DAC, to a streamer DAC with Octave and native DSD256/PCM it would also be a perfect attractive partner to these active speakers.

Also for their new M1200’s power amps, for those who love tubes, separates, speaker cables and passive speakers.

The fact that I don’t have to buy those separates and extra cables, open the door to the all discrete, high end, balanced connected single box Pre-Phono Amp, Streamer DAC of the equally Dutch Mola Mola.

Sorry to be pounding on the Dutch, I just am amazed how the fact that Philips stopped their medium budget HiFi business, and the inevitable lay off or exodus of experts actually caused a leap step forward in the Audio Tech industry in our small but beautiful country.

It tells me, especially in these uncertain times: Don’t be afraid of changes.

Fuel cell or electric cars, driven by DC motors have so much torque, that they outperform even some sports cars. The future is still bright, even if it doesn’t really look like it at this moment. I think it’s time for changes.

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Don’t forget Kharma Loudspeakers from Breda.

I bought the wife a Nissan Leaf last year and she loves it. So do I!

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I also have 10 or 12 pieces of PS Audio gear to go along with the PF and D&D so I am supporting high quality hand built manufacturing wherever it is world wide.

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I truly support hand made too, as I learned to hand make steel and wood parts, myself.

For what it’s worth. As I am re-entering this hobby. Till now I have never spent so much money on a single piece of Audio equipment, as on the Stellar Gain Cell DAC.

The Abacus speakers are hand made locally and (now) affordable for me. Being more or less local to them, I can benefit from the same advantages with them as you can in the US from PS Audio. They are also an innovative family company something I appreciate PS Audio for as well. They offer test deals, I can pick a set of speakers up from their factory, where everybody is also welcome to listen and they are proudly showing customers around.

Should I not like the speakers I can return them within the agreed time frame and pay a compensation or pick up new ones and pay those. Fair deal.

Personally, I want my electronics made by robots and tested by computer and under high powered microscopes.

When things like cars and any number of machines were hand-made they had, by today’s standards, very high failure rates. The Japanese receivers of the 1970s are a classic example of automated manufacture lasting many decades. Now virtually all car manufacture is automated and failure rates are almost entirely wear and tear only.

People complain that many consumer goods are no longer serviceable. The reason is that it is far cheaper to replace them that maintain a skilled service team. It is not really waste as there are so few failures.

One of the most robust form of electronics are mobile phones, which is critical because there are billions in use around the world and they are complex devices. The fact that my audio system was designed by mobile phone engineers and manufactured using the same parts and robots was a big selling point.

I’ve read about PS Audio’s relatively high failure rate. The only Devialet failure that I’ve heard reported in 5 years was a faulty power socket.

Don’t talk to me about expensive components like Mundorf capacitors and Sowter transformers. I’ve been there, had an Art Audio Jota 300B-XLS valve amp, not up to the job.

My speakers are hand-made, but put through rigorous computerised testing.

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There is a lot of satisfaction in being able to talk to the person responsible for making a piece of gear that you have or are considering. Having an actual contact adds a lot of credibility to the product. Once an item make is to a big box store much of that personal experience is traded for lower cost. There is gear to fit all price points and trade offs have to exist to satisfy those criteria. I am willing to pay more money to support a small business that I can have close personal contact with the owners. GR Research speakers is another very small business in the USA that you also have personal contact with the owner. There are many more in the mid to high end of many different product lines.

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I should have used better words, I appreciate craftsmanship and like you appreciate high quality. To me, setting up a flawless production line, manual or automated and quality system is craftsmanship.

Like Baldy, I appreciate the atmosphere with the smaller easier to approach companies.

That applies to many brands we talked about in this thread. When I sent questions to HD Swiss, Rowen, Octave, Aloudo and Thorens, I got very informative, personal and useful answers. That indeed makes a difference worthwhile paying a bit more for or paying a reasonable compensation for test units after testing them in my own home in my own system.

Due to the personal approach of PS Audio I decided to buy the SGCD back than. The import mark up on that unit was reasonable at that time.

Devialet is made in France and is relatively cheap (an Expert 140 all-in-one is €5,000) because of the high degree of automation and relatively few humans. Their hardware effectively has a 0% failure rate and their customer service is terrible. Upgrades are done online with door-to-door collection and is very efficient.

Linn is made in Scotland and has a huge number of staff in their production department and so it is quite expensive for what it is. Don’t know how they do it, but it is very reliable. All service is through dealers.

IAG is big (Quad, Wharfdale, Audiolab etc.) and you have the best of both worlds - very friendly service from their base in the UK where they service and their own high-tech manufacturing village in Schenzen.

Rega have lots of staff, but subcontract a lot stuff like circuit boards, but also have very high volume. They make about 4,000 turntables per week, and loads of other stuff. It’s all very reliable. Their service is allegedly great, but they don’t go wrong. There is also a big Rega after-market.

Paul has mentioned that they send out quite a lot of stuff, like circuit boards, and the Sprout I recall is Chinese made, but they are still quite expensive and prone to failure - or at least the hand built stuff.

dCS is high tech manufacture and tested like no one else - for days on end using their own designed test equipment, and it’s pretty much money-no-object and bullet-proof.

So there are loads of ways of doing things, but I do wonder about PSA because they have quite a lot of products that would be better done different ways and certainly the Stellar amps seem quite expensive. I don’t recall any complaints about them failing, which is good.

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I agree with Rudolf, there is great potential in active speaker sets. I assembled 3-way active speakers with Scan Speak speakers - beryllium tweeter, 18 cm midrange and 28 cm woofer. A closed enclosure with 45 mm thick walls and a weight of 46 kg was made by a carpentry workshop producing only speaker enclosures. Each speaker has its own Hypex NC 500 amplifier, power supply is provided by Hypex SMPS 1200 (+/- 85 V, P max 1500 W).
I am an advocate of the analog crossover. Initially I had DSP, in each channel I could turn on up to 15 filters, but why all this, if the sound was tragic, why process the signal twice (A / D, D / A) ? If you have good speakers and a suitable enclosure (designing a closed enclosure is not difficult), a 24 dB / oct crossover with good components will sound good right away - I have a division at 180 Hz and 2700 Hz, the 2-channel oscilloscope showed me a slight phase incompatibility at 2700 Hz and I adjusted the high pass filter a little. Any differences in the efficiency of the speakers are leveled in a few seconds with the mounting potentiometer. Initially, my speakers had -3 dB at 40 Hz. I used only 1 additional subsonic filter with the lowest frequencies boost. Currently - 3 dB I have at 25 Hz, and in the range of 30 Hz - 180 Hz the characteristics are within +/- 1.5 dB.
I spent about 5000 Euro on loudspeakers, enclosures and electronics. Designing and assembly took me about 100 hours.
The Audio Video Show has been taking place in Warsaw for 23 years in November. In Europe, only HIGH END MUNICH is the largest exhibition. Please watch the report from 2019 - https://audioshow.pl/pl/foto
I was at presentations of many systems many times more expensive than mine and I never felt jealous, and in most cases I was convinced that my system (DMP, WW Platinum Starlight 7 HDMI, DSD Windom, Van den Hul MC - The Platinum Hybrid MK II XLR, P5, Verastarr Grand Illusion Signature power cables) sounds better, with nicer timbre, more depth and precision of the bass and more details.

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I use both active (kef ls50ws) and passive speakers. No effort trying to match the right amp to the kefs but for many that is all part of the fun. Almost got a great deal on pair of kii threes but would have had to drive a few hundred miles. The kefs are good but I keep wondering what the kiis would do.

I also have a tesla that requires no tinkering and a miata with a corvette engine that could use a new exhaust and that requires E85 prior to emissions testing. No more emissions testing is one small advantage of an EV. There are tuning shops for teslas but they are limited to suspension and aero.

Do you have a picture of it?

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I attach a photo taken today - because the whole weighs about 60 kg, it stands on six Gaia II isolators. I also tested 4 Gaia I isolators, the effect was similar and the cost was 2 times higher.
The second photo taken early shows electronics

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Very impressive !!!

Very impressive indeed!

Where did you manage to get the analog filter?