Class AB differential power amplifier

Dear fellow audio enthusiasts,

A second year electro student here. Since a couple of months I’ve been working on this power amp idea. I somewhat know how to design for good CMRR and PSRR levels but have no idea what to look out for when speaking about THD and whatnot.

Furthermore the JFET input stage voltage gain is counterintuitively smaller than one because it allows for a greater voltage swing at the pnp emitter follower. Any thoughts on this or any other aspect of this design? Any suggestions for nice small signal btj’s or potential power supply options?

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated.
Much thanks and cheers,

Ruben

Some more info and specs:

  • Vcc is 33 to 35 volts. Ill be using 25VAC, >300VA per channel
  • T1 is tuned so the DC voltage at the output nodes is Vcc/2.
    MultiSim simulation shows:
  • 100W into 4 ohms
  • High output current (>13A peak to peak)
  • voltage gain is about 25dB, rolls off 70udB at 30kHz.
  • input imdedance is in the giga ohm range
  • output impedence is 202mOhms (low enough?)
  • CMRR and PSRR >100dB

2 Likes

Welcome!

If you haven’t already tried, I would try diyaudio.com - a lot of designers hang out there.

Nice to see so many bipolars in use rather than all FET (personal opinion only) :slight_smile:
My own thoughts - build it, listen to it, and tune it.

Partly because deep analysis of analogue circuits is beyond me now, and partly because
the lowest THD and whatnot don’t always sound the most musical and enjoyable to audiophile ears.
It would be good to actually listen to multiple iterations and (if you have the kit) aalyse the distortion etc. after you have listened to it.
(and please report back!) :slight_smile:

2 Likes

Will do Joma I posted it there too. I hear you and i’m tempted to order all these parts, though I gotta watch my modest budget, so only if this design is worth it Ill build it. And for sure if any progress I will report back!

Cheers

1 Like

if it sounds great i might want one :wink:

Hi Rupopulles,

Welcome and thanks for joining our community. I would certainly try to the join diyaudio if you haven’t already.

Here’re a few quick notes after a quick glance at the circuit here:

Add shunt resistors around 100K from your input gates to ground. Without defining the input impedance, the gates will float up and you’ll have problems. 100K is typical for this. No need to use a JFET for Q26. I’d just replace this with a BJT junction based configuration such as Q12/Q10. For these small signal transistors you can use something that is general purpose such as 2n5551/2n5401. You may have temptations to use high beta devices but I’d suggest not using those parts due to the much higher risk of parasitic oscillations and run away.

I’m curious why you’ve decided to float the output up instead of using a bipolar supply and aiming to get around 0VDC on the outputs. My guess is that you wanted to eliminate a supply. You just better hope that both sides stay well behaved in DC and don’t start to slip on you or your speaker will start to possibly see some significant offsets.

The output stage is where I start getting concerned a bit. The configuration is similar to a diamond output where the current running down the driver stage is reflected on the output. You need emitter resistors to define this current since you are essentially using the junction drops to get to 0 voltage on the output. You can start at Q14/Q15 and follow the junctions on each side of the complementary circuit. You’ll see that overall, the ideal DC operating point is 0V from the base of Q14/Q15.

One issue that won’t show up in simulations is thermal runaway on the outputs. I have found these configurations to be challenging to thermally stabilize and one way you can help mitigate this is to also add emitter resistors to Q14/Q15. My guess is that there will be some trial and error here to make sure the output stage is stable.

Finally, you don’t have any negative feedback in the design. Negative feedback is incredibly useful for power amplifiers. Feedback lowers output impedance, dramatically lowers distortion and helps with DC stability. I’m guessing this was a design decision but thought I’d mention that for power amplifiers, feedback is an incredible tool to optimize performance.

My suggestion is to add a negative power rail, add emitter resistors, and look into DC servos using a JFET opamp to servo the outputs in reference to ground. This will help with DC drift on the output especially since you aren’t using NFB.

That was a quick overlook on the circuit and didn’t look into gain/other specifics but I’m impressed coming from someone in their second year of EE. Good work.

If you’d like to talk further, PM me.

Best of luck and happy listening

-Darren

6 Likes

I’d be happy to talk more about it! Feel free to contact me. :slight_smile:

2 Likes

click on his name above, a mini profile should appear and on there is a message button :slight_smile:

Hi Ruben,

You can also just email me at darren@psaudio.com

Look forward to talking!

The forum software does not allow PMs until you have been around for a bit more.

@DarrenMyers,

Very gracious of you to offer assistance to a fellow EE (student in this case). I’ve been a practicing EE for about 37 years now and also try to help anyone showing this level of interest. We all get much better at our “art” by leveraging those with more and different experiences.

I also agree with @joma0711 that after further design refinement it’s very valuable to build a prototype even if there are some “failures”. As I’m sure you know those are the best and longest lasting lessons in your professional development.

Well done,
Kurt

EDIT: Just realized how old this thread is and wonder if progress was made with the amplifier design and build.

1 Like

Generous indeed,

Got me a great start. Though things really kicked off once I moved this to diyaudio.com.
After that I moved towards single ended fully complementary. which evolved into this;




Now this design including a dc servo and some voltage regulation is what id like to put in a nice box.
Power supply impedance is rather critical here which is why i’m still up in the air about the overall physical layout.

I just stumbled upon this thread while searching google images. Coincidentally there was fresh activity.
Go figure.
Cheers!

2 Likes

@Rupopulles DIYaudio is good for this kinda thing, can be a bit noisy but there are a lot of experienced folks there.
Getting advice here from Darren (their senior analogue design dude now I think) was pretty cool too :slight_smile:

Glad you came back to update us, I look forward to more updates :slight_smile: