@Veneet - that is SO helpful! So I would keep my gigabit FMC’s (MC200CM) and run them from my router to a dedicated switch, then plug both my NAS and my BridgeII into the switch? That would work well. Do I use both of the optical ports on the MC200CM (TX and RX) with a multi-cable, or just use a single optical cable to connect TX to RX? Also, when buying a switch, what should I look for? Any recommendations for a switch? Thanks again, Peter
So, to your first question, that should be how it would work with the switch, it would negotiate the correct speed for the bridge, nas and FMCs so it all works together (in theory, if you have a switch sitting around at home you can try it out).
The second question is difficult for me to say, I would think yes, but I don’t cant really say as mine is single mode so I use this cable between them
But yours would be a multimode fiber cable, someone else hopefully can chime in…
Curiosity, how is your NAS currently hooked up to your network now, straight into your router? Also, is your bridge hooked straight into your router now?
My bridge is connected directly to the router with a 30 foot cat5 cable. The NAS is connected to the router through a switch. Thanks!
So I guess if the switch is a 100/1000 (or 10/100/1000) switch it should be as you said router->FMCs->Switch with both the NAS and Bridge connected to that switch. IF the switch is only 1000 (gigabit) then you will have the same issue again as the bridge wont connect to it. You could test really quick hooking your bridge straight to the switch and see if it can play music from your NAS.
Others may chime in with better solutions.
A few points from my experience that may help (I’m sure I’ve posted this info before elsewhere on the forum but perhaps worth repeating).
- The cable you show from Amazon has 2 connections, one each for transmit (TX) and receive (RX). The good thing about buying the cable in this form is that the cables are crossed so that TX connects to RX and RX to TX which is what you want. I bought individual cables and at first mistakenly connected TX to TX and RX to RX, which of course did not work.
- The switch solution proposed will work OK but seems like overkill to me when what you wish to do is isolate the DAC from interference. Putting an optical link in the last ethernet run to the DAC should be sufficient but I would advise that you move your NAS well away from the DAC to minimise RF interference from its processor, power supply and disk drives (6’ minimum I’d suggest). I’d also advise getting a linear power supply for the FMC nearest to the DAC, to replace the switched mode power supply that comes with the FMC.
- The question of 10/100 or gigabit FMCs can be resolved if you check the renderer (Bridge in this case I guess) / DAC requirements with the manufacturer - some renderers/DACs will not work with gigabit FMCs. I enquired and was told to use 10/100 FMCs; interestingly Sonore said they did not support gigabit on their Rendu renderer because it introduced RF interference.
- After several years of use one of my TP-Link FMCs failed. I found TP-Link’s support excellent: they walked me through diagnostics via email, requesting photos of light indications to determine the fault. Mine was dead which was no big deal as replacement cost is low.
- For comprehensive information, including a parts list and user experience, here is where I first learned about this means of optical isolation:
https://andreweverard.com/2015/06/08/high-resolution-audio-now-with-added-fibre/
This product looks promising
Hopefully it will be available soon
Just a stray thought, but the best Ethernet isolator is probably WiFi.
It might be interesting to take a wireless access point with an Ethernet filter on the output, and see how that compares with wire.
I’m currently running my Aries WiFi rather than Wired, so I can now take the Bridge card out of the DSD and remove a network hub iPower from the power block, to see if all that makes any noticeable difference.
I don’t know how to make my DSD any happier, with only a galvanic-isolated USB coming in, no Bridge, and balanced cable out.
Old post, but eldrick did you have any positive feedback on this WiFi isolation technique?
I do this out of necessity for my living room system running a Hegel integrated amplifier.
I ditched the Aries after discovering limitations in its handling of playlists.
The Aries did not get good wifi reception at about 30 feet from my router, so I wound up running it with wire.
I presently use ethernet with a filter in front of the DSD Bridge.
Personally I can’t tell any obvious difference among the various types of connection, but I’m biased by my bits-are-bits belief system. 6ˆ)
Those Emosafe en-70e isolators work well. I have three of them and some of my audiophile friends have even more. Daisy chained from router to dac. So with 4 Emosafes you need 5 ethernet cables. The more you add them,the better it comes. And you can hear the improvement immediately as cleaner ,more transparent sound. Highly recommended tweak. If you run straight cat cable from switch or router to dac,you will be amazed when you install these.
I have a pair of TP Link MC100CM feeding my Bridge II. The MC100CM that connects to the Bridge via ethernet cable appears to be the most sensitive in the circuit.
Tried a number of external psu such as Teddy Pardo, Sbooster MKII and ended up staying with HDplex 100 watts 2016 model doing the 9vdc. This the most enjoyable music that has emitted from my system. I am so hooked that I have ordered the 200watts 2019 model to see if there might be a great difference.
Teddy Pardo and Sbooster are really good also but it comes down to which one is most enjoyable for me.
HDplex also feeds the Ted Smith pcb at 12vdc in my DSD dac and the original PS Audio psu feeds the other pcb.
My router/modem and NAS also get feed by separate Teddy Pardos.
The use of the red Wireworld Cat 8 and Tera Grand really also helps.
These external PSUs are the heartbeat in my system
If you are able please try larger external PSUs
Shunyata have new ethernet cable products about to hit the market.
Venom = $295
Alpha = $600
Sigma = $900
Might be worth a try for the ethernet cable tweakers out there.
Not sure if I’ve posted this before, but recent fibre optic inclusion as shown. Digital signal path in yellow, power in red.
The Cisco switch, fibre connector, cable, TPLink and ifi low noise power supply cost a total of about £180, say $250. I’ve only ever bought one expensive ethernet cable, an AQ Cinnamon, and it sits between the Roon server and audio player. All the others are from Amazon.
The Shunyata Delta EF is a revelation. It is on loan, but I will be buying one. May get one for the Innuos and the UK6 block instead of the P3, not least because I can demo them first.
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@JeffofArabica, @Baldy, @cardri, and @qzfrj6. You have all purchased the GigaFoil Ethernet Filter and seem to be very happy with the purchase in its ability to clean up noise and make the SQ jump in your ethernet connection. GigaFOIL Ethernet Filter Has Launched. I have posted this request in the Ethernet Isolator post because I think there are other folks that would benefit from your comments in the Gigafoil Ethernet thread. I respect your opinions and wanted to get some more of them and ask a few questions. Also, anybody else that has opinions on isolating Ethernet noise chirp in. (@tedsmith always respect your thoughts)
I am currently using a Baetis Prodigy Server that has my Roon Core. (I am a Roon addict). The Prodigy Server currently is connected to the DS DAC via ethernet with a crapply router and crappy ethernet cables. (I can also connect the Prodigy via USB and BNC but my questions are related to maximizing the ethernet connections.) I am going to put the GIGAFoil filter right before the DS DAC wich feeds a BHK Pre; BHK 300’s, P20, feeding Maggie 20.7s and 2 REL Carbon Ltd Subs. I have nice interconnects, cabling, and power cables.
My thought is that if the GigaFoil does its job why would I care about the noise created by the crappy router and crapply cables prior to entering the GigaFoil? I am thinking of budgeting my dollars and focusing on reducing noise on everything that the GigaFoil ends up feeding. (e.g. good ethernet cable that would feed the Bridge II from the GigaFoil). I was also thinking of getting the Bridge II out of the DAC and replacing it with something that could accept ethernet and stream and feed the DS via optical or I2S without going through the Matrix shuffle to I2S.
Am I missing something by ignoring reducing the noise before the Gigafoil with better cables or a better router? Any comments greatly appreciated
@minnesotafats My system is probably not as audiophile pure as many but in my case I still have a standard netgear WAP/router and 8 port switch but I do use blue jeans CAT6 cables from the WAP/router to the TV, Denon AVR, Oppo 203, GIGA Foil isolator, and Nucleus + . I have the GIGA Foil routed to the network port on my Nuc+ as I send the music to the DS Jr via a Matrix and Pangea HDMI cable to the I2S port. I do have IFI LPS power supplies on everything including the WAP / router and netgear switch. In my case it did make enough of a difference to be worth the money spent. An AQVOX switch and high dollar HDMI cable may help but I think the BJC CAT6 cables really cant be beat. Others will argue but the science and quality speak for themselves.
@cardri can go into more detail on the GIGA Foil if needed as he has the GIGA Foil along with much higher quality connections and power supplies in his system.
Hope this helps
I’ve been following this with interest. I think in my next house, rather than running wired Ethernet through the place I will consider running MM fiber through the walls as the main transfer medium.
Thank you. Your thoughts do help. I am always interested in what people try and what they have learned from their experiences.
@minnesotafats - Netgear AS4000 WAP/router to AQVOX-SE switch w/ 100ft CAT7, then AQVOX CAT7 (50cm) to Giga FOIL, then AQVOX CAT7 (25cm) to N+, J Maxwel “data only” USB (12in) cable to Matrix; Nordost HDMI (1m) to DSD. I use to run the Giga FOIL into the DSD BII and got rid of that end-point. I use a +5V Sbooster w/ Ultra to power AQVOX-SE; use +5V Sbooster w/ Ultra to power Giga FOIL; use +5V Sbooster w/ Ultra to power Matrix; use 18V Sbooster to power N+; have 18V FARAD coming to A/B against Sbooster for N+. Each step has been an evolution with benefit each time. I’m not really a group thinker so I try something and if it works, keep it and post results for the group thinkers to digest and debate. I find there is no better approach to getting your system better than just trying an idea. All systems are different; therefore, best to buy gear and try the gear. Giga FOIL filters are sold from southern CA with a 30 day return policy. Buy it, listen and return if it does not sound better. No science needed, no group think either, just your ears… and some leg work getting and returning products.
Recently I’ve separated the Ethernet/streamer power supply inputs from all my PSA gear (DMP, DSD, BHKPREE, BHK300). Running that to an EVO 3 Sirus then to the top plug of an SR BLUE wall duplex that contains a single run 20A 10ga from panel.
Hope this helps…
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Thank you. I agree with your empericist approach of trying things. What is your new endpoint?
@minnesotafats - Nucleus+ is my endpoint for the Ethernet after I got rid of the BII. I didn’t believe the Matrix approach until I tried it and OMG it is better. Removed the BII and sold the unit. I run the Matrix external PS voltage at 5.15V too, manual says 6V min… not a group thinker… I’ve been running it at that voltage for over a month with zero issues. I run all my supplies as low as they can be run, from what the PS experts say - it helps the noise spectrum. However, the Sbooster Ultra (active filter) has very tight regulation (<25mV) so that may help. The AQVOX-SE was added when I had the BII and have not A/Bed its affect since getting rid of the BII.
N+ - I have owned it for 8months and it has been flawless (zero issues). The SQ is amazing and software is flawless. My next step is PF 2.16 however, I didn’t think the N+ would be as amazing as it has been so that will be in a few years. FARAD is an spin-off of Pink Faun. Mattijs is a great resource, so is Wiebren (Sbooster). The FARAD LPS looks amazing and a few have said it is better than Sbooster w/ no Ultra… will be running that through the paces in a few weeks. They just shipped today.
Hope this helps…