Giving Back - [Howto]: Gapless audio on PWD II with Bridge

J.P.,

I’ve grown very, very tired of A/B comparisons over the years. I realized a while back that those sort of things sucked out the joy of listening to music. The last thing I want to do is start comparing routers and Ethernet cables. Lou certainly seems to know of what he speaks, so I’m very happy to benefit from his experiences and judgement.



Rich

@ richs- don’t you know it brother ;-), and no worries about the questions. I haven’t spent allot of time comparing different ethernet cables, etc, but I know that overall, I am enjoying music quite a bit more now, music flows, feet tap, and I can listen to the system for hours without fatigue. How much contribution the ethernet cable / switch / going direct adds or removes, I am not sure.



HP Switch for $209 is a good deal. I wouldn’t worry about length, if you buy properly terminated ethernet cables that are certified for Gigabit ethernet, and are properly shielded, you shouldn’t have any issues going 25, 50 or even 100 feet.



My recommendation would be to not put any switches or computer equipment in your component rack. I used to have my dedicated media server on a separate shelf, plugged into its own circuit, which was on its own grounding rod, but close to my audio equipment. And I was anal about shielding, EMI / RFI noise elimination… That said, once I moved all computer equipment away from the audio, and moved to ethernet into the Bridge, my system had better air, pace, and just more organic sounding once all of the computer stuff was moved off into a different part of the basement. I cannot wait until my DS upgrade kit arrives - based on @gordon’s feedback so far, my expectations will be high!



If you have a centralized area to place your NAS and switch, that is away from your audio components (either in another room, or in another area of the basement (like me)) is ideal. In my experience doing so will yield better overall sonic results. I would consider a UPS to run your NAS and Switch to protect against any AC issues, and keep the noisy switch, computer, NAS AC isolated from polluting the rest of the home’s AC. Possibly consider a double-conversion UPS, as they are always generating clean AC power - so there is no cut-over delay to switch from AC to DC like there is with a standard line-interactive UPS.



Although not really great for audio components (I think due to high output impedance), you can pick up a Liebert or Tripp-Lite Double conversion UPS as a refurb for a couple hundred dollars. The good ones (like liebert or tripp lite) do generate a low distortion AC wave much like the Power Plants. The double conversion UPSs still have higher output distortion than any of the PS Audio Power plants (another reason they are not good for audio equipment), but for computers and switching power supplies they are great.



Here is some additional information: http://www.upsforless.com/doubleconversionupss-1.aspx These guys are good to deal with. In my config, I have only my media server connected to the double conversion UPS, all of my network gear is plugged into another APC UPS. I could probably stream audio through my home for two hours in a power outage - mind you, not sure what good it would do, as I wouldn’t be able to listen to it on anything… :smiley:



… okay, i’ll stop rambling now. Hopefully this answers your questions.

Interesting that you mentioned the HP 1810 switch. When the power supply in my trusty Cisco Catalyst 3750 gave off smoke, I spent a couple of week comparing various models and finally the HP 1810 v2 became the only choice. I’ve been using it for over a year now and very happy.



BTW, check eBay. Here’s HP 1810-24G for $129:



HP 1810-24G switch on eBay



Or an 8-port version if 24 ports is too much:



HP 1810-8G switch on eBay



Make sure it’s Version 2!

Gotta love ebay - I think that is what I paid for mine - but I have the V1 and bought almost four years ago, it is a nice switch.

louawalters said: Gotta love ebay

Or yes, I buy almost exclusively on eBay. Unless I"m in a hurry...

Minim is at a completely different development stage nowadays. For example, you can choose two different transcoding libraries.


Thanks for mentioning this. Installed the newest version of Minim and am quite impressed. The addition of MinimStreamer has made all the difference.

Sorry for the noob question. The current bridge is streaming the dsd files from NAS to new DS DAC?

The current Bridge will stream single rate DSD to the DS using DoP (as Paul explained in a recent post, DoP is a container file that makes DSD look like PCM so the computer will stream it as such but the DSD data is not converted to PCM).

Lou,



I need a new router but looking at the user comments onAmazon for this ASUS you are using about 15 % of the reviews are only one star, due largely to time related drop out issues or just no longer working. Many reviews seem credible by knowledgable people, but I am sure yours has been fine or you would not have recommended it but I get concerned reading this. How long have you had yours and wondering if anyone else has experience with this ASUS router, RTAC 68U. Thks

I have the RT-AC66U (penultimate model), but that was not your question :slight_smile:

I know of no one who is unhappy with their AirPort Extreme router.

Exceptionally easy to expand and long lasting consistent performance.

Gordon said: Exceptionally easy to expand

Gordon,

Could you explain what you mean by that? I now need one more connection than I have space for on my AirPort Extreme. I think the usual procedure in such situations is to buy a switch and plug it in to one of the slots on the router, but if there is some other way in the Apple universe I'd like to know about it. (The AE is my only piece of Apple equipment.)

So your has been fine for how long ?

I know of no one who is unhappy with their AirPort Extreme router.
Exceptionally easy to expand and long lasting consistent performance.


Yes it has been on my list

@magister0

By expansion I mean to extend the network area by using Airport Express units.

They extend the WiFi zones as well as give ethernet ports in each of the zones.

If you need more ports at your router, then a switch is appropriate.



Depending on what you are connecting to the AE, you can also use, for example, an Apple TV to stream to a TV as well as other “AirPlay” devices.

The Apple ease of “inter-connectivity” is one of it’s strong points.

http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/airplay.htm

@rogerdn Not sure why that is so, I’ve had the Asus router since Dec 20, and not a single dropout ever. I have had some power outages, and my UPS is configured to shutdown when the power comes back, so for me that is the only time I have ever lost network connectivity. The WiFi is excellent - works from my basement, all the way up to the second story, in the garage, and out on the front porch. The ASUS is overkill if you are not tech savvy, as it has an advanced interface, which many find complicated. But it has stellar Wifi performance (which was my main reason for purchasing). Outside of WiFi nothing else runs off of that router (except for a connection to my WAN). All other wired connections in my house come off my HP 48 port gigabit switch.

Just want to add - since configuring my PS Bridge and new server with FooBar 2000 (as described in the OP), I have NEVER, not once, had a dropped packet, or hiccup with audio. I have perfect gapless playback, without a single issue. I can create playlists on the fly with different sample rates, and music just streams. Even DSD (with realtime conversion to PCM). In my system, sound quality via the bridge (with this configuration) is significantly better than my existing JPLAY configuration with two dedicated servers, Paul Pang USB card, and USB to I2S converter. I wasn’t expecting this, but I can say that music flows much nicer with this config…



I cannot wait until my Direct Stream kit arrives :smiley:

@louawalters

:smiley:

Thks Lou, not being a network guy I think I will go with the Mac router.

Sitting here listening to Abbey Road, JRiver > Bridge…what a joke. The bridge is the only reason I bought this DAC in the first place. If foobar2000 can come up with at least a player side solution for gapless why JRiver/PS Audio can’t is beyond me. Yet we’re supposed to invest another 3 large to upgrade to the DirectStream so PS Audio doesn’t have to put more money into fixing their previously flawed product, or jump through hoops trying to integrate and configure other solutions on our own. Am I wrong?