It’s great to have a few different sounding systems…tailored for different rooms
Welcome aboard!
Job_Jalink hit on the key first considering - compromises and constraints. But it also depends on what your expectations are for how much you want get out of your rig. Do you know what you’re looking for? If you’re content with a 2D soundstage then speaker placement is less important.
Well, if that is an option, why are we sill having this conversation?
I was not serious about a second system.
Ginormous.
I was just joshin’ with you.
Cheers
Personally, I like my listening spaces on the small to medium side (by American standards) because I like a “cozy” feel to the experience. I’ve visited a number of larger listening rooms among audio club members and they all felt somewhat like you’re in an underpopulated theatre viewing. I imagine decor and room design had a bit to do with that though. Something around 13’ x 18’ to 16’ x 21’ or so with high ceilings are my sweet spot.
I notice mention is often made of glass surfaces being a detriment to good sound. The reflectivity of glass is little different from drywall. The real issue seems that it’s hard to gracefully deal with treating that surface if needed. I recall somewhere in GIK acoustics various communications their mentioning that if the center wall is glass, acoustically treating it is of much less concern than treating first reflection points in achieving good sound. Robert Harley’s video blog about his collaboration with an acoustician building his new listening space also mentioned how the concern over glass surfaces was overblown.
The one thing I can add is I went from a 13 x 24 to a 16 x 25. Both treated very similar. The 3 extra feet made a big difference. The new room was also able to pull away from front wall maybe 6”-12” more…
And who says size doesn’t matter? Lol
Not me!
Hi Skip, mentioning your age, I just retired at 66, and am hoping I’ll have more time to participate in the forum. I’ve read through the replies, so here are my 2 pennies (they won’t be around too much longer I guess).
I think it’s fantastic that you’re working on the room. When I got back into more serious listening about 7 years ago, I realized I didn’t have nearly the budget to buy really expensive audio gear. I read several articles online that said the biggest improvement you can make in your listening is not your gear - assuming you have at least decent stuff - but the room. It said something along the lines of “a good room will allow you to hear what your speakers are really putting out - something most people are throwing away by not considering the room.” So read, and ask questions. if you’re at all interested (or bored) in what I went through, here’s a link to the topic I started a few years ago - it was before there was a special Rooms category.
As for the size of room, I’ve read several responses and agree with what most people have said. When I started on the project, I had bad news and good news - the bad was that I was stuck with a pretty small space - about 12 x 15 feet. Fortunately I had a high ceiling to work with. The good news was that I was building this in an unfinished basement and had freedom and budget to configure the actual size of the space. There’s a really cool calculator that tells you how to set up your basic dimensions closest to what’s called the “gold ratio” that minimizes bad sound nodes.
I won’t bore you with the total project, but here are the basics of what I did that I’m certain improved the end results:
- Improved the quality of AC power by pulling an independent sub-panel taking several steps to reducing impedance.
- Sound-proofed the room as much as possible. Since I had control of the construction, I did the “room within a room” idea. It lowered the noise floor significantly and minimized other factors that can interfere with hearing what my speakers are producing.
- Having read a lot, and gotten assistance from a fellow PS Audio forum member, went to great lengths on internal room treatments to deal with a pretty small space - I did these myself, and I’m NOT a woodworker! These you are welcome to read about using the link I provided.
- When it comes to gear, I chose and configured for a smaller space, but opted to go with equipment suited for a bit larger space, figuring it would be better to “dumb down” a bigger system than “push up” a smaller system.
- Finally, once I got in the room, I invested in room-correction software and went through the process. My goal has always been to reproduce as closely as possible what the mixing and mastering engineers heard in THEIR room where they decided the recording was as good as they could achieve. Interestingly, I found in my research that THEY use smaller rooms in which to mix & master, so why should I be different?
The end result to my ears is a wonderful cross between a larger room and “near-field” listening. I get the intimacy and imaging I really love, but in no way do I think I’ve sacrificed soundstage size. When I close my eyes (which I do most of the time when listening), I’m in whatever space the recording seeks to emulate. With all the bass-trapping and panel coverage, I worried about creating a “dead” room where I could have shrugged and gone headphones instead, but there’s life in there. And incredibly accurate bass I can hear and feel as intended.
We’ll probably move to another house before I head for that great listening room in the sky, and I’d probably opt for a bit larger room next time, but in no way would I be disappointed with a smaller space. I hope your adventure is as fun and rewarding as mine has been.
It depend on the definition of Large? and small?
For me large, is like a house 60 x 40 feet’s and equivalent ratio 2400 Sq feet’s
Medium is like 20 x 20 feet’s and equivalent ratio of 400 Sq feet’s
Small is like a bedroom 10 x 10 feet’s and equivalent ratio of 100 Sq feet’s
So for me a medium room and often the family room too!
- speaker a 4 feet’s from the back
- 1 to 3 feet’s from the side
- Sub on the side 1 feet and 5 feet’s from the back
- Hifi gear in the center, no choice it is a family room!
- if I could near me in the front seat, nothing else between speakers
- A projector for movie and a mechanical screen
Broke out my vintage small room system just to run some electricity through it in a spare room… transformer engaged (wish a PSA Power Plant could lower voltage to Japan’s 100 from the US 120) - bought when living in Japan in my first smallish apartment… ended up with a proper house and listening room later on and new gear, but could never part with my first love despite how much bteer i find the sound of big spaces ‘filled’ (with plenty of empty space for all the notes) with ‘big’ equipment
Couldn’t you replace the transformer? Or let it do?
Not sure - just bought a couple of 120→100 transformers specifically for Japan appliances to be used in the US - don’t listen to this system often tho so satisfied as is and the sound is still amazing. Esoteric won’t even answer queries, model too old they say - still sounds great. Would entertain trading in when I buy the FR20s on my radar, but doubt PSA wants the 100v gear…. dang, gotta keep them! 