Paul McGowan said
There simply wasn't room on the rear panel. Many people, myself included, go balanced on the main amplifier and single ended on the sub amp.
This doesn’t constitute a problem since most sub plate amplifiers take RCA and have a gain adjustment for level compensation, but are you saying that since the preamp does not contain a trafo on its output (like the DS) the RCA connection does not unbalance the XLR when both are connected?
That is correct. You can use both the RCA and XLR outputs of the preamp without upsetting anything.
Green Machine said Out of curiosity, have you ever operated your system without a pre-amp ? If so, any chance you would be kind enough to also indicate how you perceive the improvement with a pre-amp (say the BHK) vs no pre-amp at all ?
I previously asked those with a DS and the new preamp to make this specific comparison.
I, too, am very curious - especially if the listener has previously concluded that no preamp is better.
So how did it sound? After about 3 hours of burn in (that’s all I could wait before sneaking a listen), I can sum up all of my impressions with one word - Better. The dynamics are better. The imaging better. The soundstage depth and width are better. Virtually any desirable characteristic you would want to consider was better with the BHK vs. the Pass Labs Preamp. Not by huge amounts, but they are better. And thats saying a lot given that the Pass Labs was considered a “statement” piece when it was introduced and originally sold for nearly twice the amount of the BHK.
All in all, its the best preamp I have ever heard. I will continue to update as new developments require.
Thanks mikeskop, really informative commentary.
Out of curiosity, have you ever operated your system without a pre-amp ? If so, any chance you would be kind enough to also indicate how you perceive the improvement with a pre-amp (say the BHK) vs no pre-amp at all ?
I have done exactly that in the past. After reading a post by Paul McGowan a few years ago about how the best preamp is no preamp, I fed my amps directly from the outputs of my DAC. The results in my system were disappointing. Because the gain of my amps are so high, I would only need to have the volume of the Directstream set at 25 - 35 to achieve realistic listening levels (I’m using all balanced connections). At those levels, the music was comparatively dull and lifeless. The sound improved somewhat with the volume over 50 but the SPL in my room at that setting is like rock concert level (>110dB) and not practical for most program material. Since that time, I have left the volume on the DAC set to 100 and always used the preamp. Hope that answers your question.
I just now pulled the BHK Pre out of the box, hooked it up and did the unthinkable. I listened to a cold, brand new device. The wife, from another room, immediately said, “Boy, that sounds good.” So, without benefit of warmup or break in, it sounds like this:
That is correct. You can use both the RCA and XLR outputs of the preamp without upsetting anything.
So for someone (not me) who needs two RCAs out, could they use an XLR to RCA adaptor or cable for one of them rather than Y-adaptors on the RCA jacks? If so, which is likely to be better?
Out of curiosity, have you ever operated your system without a pre-amp ? If so, any chance you would be kind enough to also indicate how you perceive the improvement with a pre-amp (say the BHK) vs no pre-amp at all ?
I’m trying to be patient while my pre-amp creeps across the Pacific to New Zealand. I haven’t used a pre-amp for quite some time and will be in a good position to comment on exactly that. Others may beat me to it though.
“I previously asked those with a DS and the new preamp to make this specific comparison.” -Elk
The BHK has been running continuously for about 7hrs now and I am enjoying it immensely. As always, it is hard to put “things audio” into words but I must say that Paul is indeed correct when he says that a good preamp adds something valuable to the sound. The upgrade of the NCore amp to the BHK 250 was nice and no question, the BHK was clearly better than the NCore, but I wasn’t thrilled. There was, and continues to be nothing wrong with it and I am completely satisfied and do recommend it, but the change just didn’t “set me off”. This preamp DOES! It pushes all the buttons and makes me not want to move from my chair. It is quick but not clinical and not the least bit euphonic. I don’t feel like I am missing anything and I am listening hard to micro dynamics and detail today. I would say that detail is on par with the “no pre” setup but micro dynamics are much better; really something to get excited about and very pleasing to listen to. It kinda reaches out and grabs you (gently) Someone came up with, or resurrected a term last year - “palpable”. The music is just very very palpable; solid sounding. My speakers are too far apart and this is something that I am stuck with in our loft. This gives a big panoramic sound but consequently, makes everything sound a tad thin, like you are watching a movie instead of real life, or more so than other systems. The BHK Pre gives an element of solidity to the music that has never been there before and I love it. Instruments sound much more distinctly individual and I think that this quality has something to do with that aspect of solidity. Sound staging is no wider than with no preamp but depth and the sense of space is improved (both quite a bit!). I’ve been doing lower level listening so I haven’t rocked it hard yet. That’ll have to wait for another day.
These things that I am hearing are not subtle. This is a big improvement in what was an already good sounding arrangement. Paul, you were right that the addition of a preamp, a good preamp, is the way to go. I just was not expecting this much positive impact on the sound. How and why it enhances these positive qualities I guess we just don’t know yet, unless I missed something. It just seems like if you add more circuitry you should surely degrade the sound but this is just not the case, at least not the case with a device of this caliber. You know me, I don’t dither about stuff. I either think something has “it” or not and the BHK Preamp has more “it” than anything that I have heard in a long, long time, not since you showed me that DS DAC prototype in Boulder! Again, thank you for adding so much to my life.
Mr. King - How can I say it adequately with all the accolades that you have gotten over the years? Ya’ know, how about just a big thank you for another extraordinary design. I can’t wait for this one to hit the mags!
I’ll be taking the pre on the road soon to a very tough cookie, Galen Gareis. He has a Pass Labs XP-30 that we will stand the BHK up against and I’ll let you all know what we thought.
Don’t get me wrong, the BHK 250 is considerably better than the NCore and I have no criticisms of the new power amp. I am just expressing that I was satisfied with the 250, thrilled with the BHK Preamp.
Don’t get me wrong, the BHK 250 is considerably better than the NCore and I have no criticisms of the new power amp. I am just expressing that I was satisfied with the 250, thrilled with the BHK Preamp.
Understand, just wondering if yours was a 400 too.
I’m curious about what headphones the rest of the beta-testers are using with their BHK. I’m still working on the write-up of my results and would appreciate hearing from any of the other reviewers. Thanks!
Green Machine said
Thanks mikeskop, really informative commentary.
Out of curiosity, have you ever operated your system without a pre-amp ? If so, any chance you would be kind enough to also indicate how you perceive the improvement with a pre-amp (say the BHK) vs no pre-amp at all ?
Mikestop said
I have done exactly that in the past. After reading a post by Paul McGowan a few years ago about how the best preamp is no preamp, I fed my amps directly from the outputs of my DAC. The results in my system were disappointing. Because the gain of my amps are so high, I would only need to have the volume of the Directstream set at 25 - 35 to achieve realistic listening levels (I'm using all balanced connections). At those levels, the music was comparatively dull and lifeless. The sound improved somewhat with the volume over 50 but the SPL in my room at that setting is like rock concert level (>110dB) and not practical for most program material. Since that time, I have left the volume on the DAC set to 100 and always used the preamp. Hope that answers your question.
Thanks mikestop.
See that your high gain amps are the Bryston 28B SST2’s; I auditioned a pair of 14B SST2’s about 18 months ago before I took on some JC-1’s which top out around the 14B’s (not your 1 / 1.2kW max output). Believe both these SS amps have very high negative feedback (and very very high output impedance, vs the BHK amps no negative feedback design and smaller output impedance).
Again, very informative comments, much appreciated.
Things are really going well with more time on BHK. Better and better.
One comment on the remote. There is an “off” for preamp directly below the preamp volume control. If in a hurry to turn volume down or not good hand position on remote, you hit the off button when trying to turn down volume. Then you wait for the tube warmup for preamp to come back to life. It has quite a life you can hardly wait for it to turn back on.
Out of curiosity, have you ever operated your system without a pre-amp ? If so, any chance you would be kind enough to also indicate how you perceive the improvement with a pre-amp (say the BHK) vs no pre-amp at all ?
I’m trying to be patient while my pre-amp creeps across the Pacific to New Zealand. I haven’t used a pre-amp for quite some time and will be in a good position to comment on exactly that. Others may beat me to it though.
Thanks, looking forward to hearing your viewpoint. Even if you feel exactly the same way as someone else has reported on the forum, I would still find quite a lot of use in seeing where the weight of opinion falls.
I'll be taking the pre on the road soon to a very tough cookie, Galen Gareis. He has a Pass Labs XP-30 that we will stand the BHK up against and I'll let you all know what we thought.
Great !
Speaking of which, did you find more improvement from the Belden cables or the BHK pre-amp ?
Oooh, good question. Given the time between the introduction of the Beldens and now that would be really testing my memory. Both were big improvements, not just a little tweak here and there. I will have to say the BHK preamp as opposed to no pre is a bigger change in my system.
These things that I am hearing are not subtle. This is a big improvement in what was an already good sounding arrangement. Paul, you were right that the addition of a preamp, a good preamp, is the way to go. I just was not expecting this much positive impact on the sound. How and why it enhances these positive qualities I guess we just don’t know yet, unless I missed something. It just seems like if you add more circuitry you should surely degrade the sound but this is just not the case, at least not the case with a device of this caliber. You know me, I don’t dither about stuff. I either think something has “it” or not and the BHK Preamp has more “it” than anything that I have heard in a long, long time, not since you showed me that DS DAC prototype in Boulder! Again, thank you for adding so much to my life.
Mr. King - How can I say it adequately with all the accolades that you have gotten over the years? Ya’ know, how about just a big thank you for another extraordinary design. I can’t wait for this one to hit the mags!
I’ll be taking the pre on the road soon to a very tough cookie, Galen Gareis. He has a Pass Labs XP-30 that we will stand the BHK up against and I’ll let you all know what we thought.
Elk, buy one.
I will be happy to forward this lovely note on to BHK. Thanks, this was well written and a joy to read.
) Someone came up with, or resurrected a term last year - “palpable”. The music is just very very palpable; solid sounding. My speakers are too far apart and this is something that I am stuck with in our loft. This gives a big panoramic sound but consequently, makes everything sound a tad thin, like you are watching a movie instead of real life, or more so than other systems. The BHK Pre gives an element of solidity to the music that has never been there before and I love it. Instruments sound much more distinctly individual and I think that this quality has something to do with that aspect of solidity. Sound staging is no wider than with no preamp but depth and the sense of space is improved (both quite a bit!). I’ve been doing lower level listening so I haven’t rocked it hard yet. That’ll have to wait for another day.