This thread brought back memories of tracks like ;
The Streets of London, Vincent,
Hello in There, 4 Wild Horses
and many others - I’m currently away from home helping one of our sons get set-up finding an apartment and all the things you need to do when moving to your 1st ‘serious’ job. It is in a small town on the coast in central Queensland a ways away from his friends and family.
lonson said I've thought long and hard about this question. . . . I think for me it boils down to "storytelling" with music. The expression of the performer taking me on a little journey, communicating to me instrumentally as well as vocally.Can it be solely instrumental, or do you need a vocal also in the track for this to work for you? If instrumental only, can it be completely unrelated to a song (as opposed to an instrumental cover of a song)?
I’m curious as my impression is lyrics are critical to many.
Oh definitely most of my listening is instrumental, I don’t need a “vocal,” that’s not the type of “story” I am referring to.
Lester Young is one of my favorite musicians. He was quoted as saying something to the extent that a soloist should know the lyrics of songs that have them and play the “story” and emotion in those lyrics. But at the same time he “told a story” on pieces with no lyrics.
For me it’s as basic as the musician “having something to say” and communicating it well, reaching out to the listener. I know it’s a tired analogy in its way, but music that is compelling to me has this component, this exchange between the players and the listeners.
In my own playing the compelling element for me is either a melody or a rhythmic structure that compels me to confront and digest and interact with it. . . . There are some “tunes” such as “Tenderly” or “Red River Valley” or “What a Friend we Have in Jesus” that I can latch onto with a guitar and amp and feel driven to state, restate, paraphrase etc. Narrate in my voice and style if you will. . . as best as I can, and over time I feel compelled to and successfully find new ways to do so.
Lester is cool. My favorite tenor sax player is Ben Webster. I have a lot of his albums. I saw one of the audiophile labels is releasing reel to reel tapes. One of the four listed was “Gentle Ben” which I don’t own. I found it on Tidal, it is really good content, and for Tidal CD quality, the sound is impressive. Some might say compelling. It is easy to hear why they choose it for one of their R to R releases.
Highly recommended!
Interestingly Ben Webster started to play the tenor in the band led by Lester Young’s father, a musician and teacher. . . .
Reading the above “back on the subject” thread - I was reminded of Jeff’s mention of Richard Thompson, “Acoustic Classics” here or in another thread. Should be something most can agree upon - storytelling “Vincent Black Lightning”, etc. - amazing and unique guitar style and technique, and while arguably not a “great” voice, one that is so perfect with his music, it’s hard to argue with. Reminds me of John Hiatt in that sense - maybe not the best singer in the world, but when he’s doing his own songs, it’s hard to beat. Interestingly they have both had very good tribute cover albums done of their work.
Plus, it’s just a great sounding, “compelling” record. Sounds like it was recorded without “fixes” - just great performances to tape, even if there are small “mistakes” here and there - as it would be live.
Badbeef, heartily concur with the Richard Thompson, he’s been a favorite of mine for a long time. His storytelling has a strong hint of sarcasm and fits my way of thinking quite well, now that’s compelling! As far as storytellers a couple that come to mind are Stan Ridgway and Aimee Mann. Stan has some real interesting tales and he has a unique voice. A good album of his is Anatomy, and the song “Train of Thought” has a good story and a compelling melody. Aimee has a nice voice but her songs do tend to the depressing side, but alas, I can relate. Lost in Space is my favorite of hers, the last song on the CD, “It’s not”, being the most compelling for me.
As for Elk’s inquiry on the need for lyrics, for me lyrics are important. Being raised on Motown (the hometown sound) and rock radio of the 60’s and 70’s lyrics are king. Strangely I do not find the music of my youth compelling, only more recent music does it for me. Since my youth I have found great joy in classical music, but the compelling part is a little harder for me to put a finger (more appropriately “ear”) on. I think Lonson’s comment about hearing the story in instrumental music is what I’m getting at, but without any musical training I’m having a hard time following the story. Kind of like a foreign language. Maybe some day that light bulb will click on …
pmotz - interesting! I’ve long noted that some folks feel lyrics are very important/of paramount importance, and others, it’s the music. I have to admit that for most of my life (including many years playing in bands around the Detroit area) lyrics were a far second to the music. I’ve come to appreciate them more over time. This is despite being a lead vocalist on hundreds of songs in live performance (!). I was more into the melody and the part I was simultaneously playing on guitar, bass or keyboards.
My wife was from the Chicago area, and was amazed (!) that I was so versed in Motown and so forth. Chicagoans thought they “owned” a lot of that music, and especially the Jackson Five, as they were from Indiana. Go Figure : )
Actually, now that I put RT on again, I realize he’s one of the musician/writers who made me more aware of lyrics. I was a pretty hardcore fan of British Isles Musicks in their various guises - their folk traditions that evolved into rock, leavened with American folk and blues, etc.
This verse/chorus just went by:
You can be a gambler
Who never drew a hand
You can be a sailor
Who never left dry land
You can be Lord Jesus
All the world will understand
Down where the drunkards roll
Down where the drunkards roll
Badbeef, I may have overstated my feelings on lyrics. The melody behind the lyrics builds on them and makes for a whole, something that lyrics alone have a hard time doing. Well done acapela certainly can be compelling, I was introduced to the Nylons by another audiophile and the human voice alone can be very compelling, but it requires a very special voice, something the singers in the Nylons had in spades. As for Motown, I won’t claim it for Detroit, but it was, shall we say, prevalent in the Detroit area in the 60’s. That is, until Berry Gordy moved the whole operation to LA in 1972. Phooey on him!
I think part of the reason lyrics were second to me (and this is not to say that they are more or less important - see Dylan, et al) - aside from personal preference - is that I had to learn dozens upon dozens of songs’ worth of them to fill sets worth of music. It was more rote memory, and I’m sure my performance of them suffered as a result.
I’ve been “getting back on the horse” lately, and with the Lowden my brother gifted to me (like RT’s guitar) I’ve been recording raw performances of songs that inspire me - and lyrics now have a lot to do with it.
If this links to my friend Ralph Covert’s test video, tell your grandchildren about Ralph’s World. Good YouTube content for young children is very important in these days of crap content. I have been helping him develop a show he’s written, and I’ve been shooting, lighting, recording audio, etc. on it. If y’all are offended, or think I’m trying to sell something (which I’m not), feel free to “thumbs down” and I’ll remove it.
Well done Beef! I found that performance compelling and inspiring. I also play guitar and sing and your performance makes me want to go back in my studio and record again. I think I’ll try to make some time in the near future. Thanks!
Rather than “thumbs down” I rated that post UP!
Agreed! Nicely done Badbeef!
Thanks, guys! This is likely an abuse of the Forums, and a precedent that one shouldn’t set. Sometimes, though, I feel it’s just time to put things out that are (arguably) unlike the streams of crap we’re now exposed to on a daily basis… 
Very nice indeed. And now we know where your screen name comes from. Thanks for sharing.
Yup - high school French class is its origin. We didn’t know any better. Wasn’t until I was in college and met some actual French citizens who had no idea why we’d come up with that. Grammatically incorrect ; )
lonson said Oh definitely most of my listening is instrumental, I don't need a "vocal," that's not the type of "story" I am referring to.That was my guess, but I hoped it would spur discussion - which it did. Great stuff.
pmotz said As for Elk's inquiry on the need for lyrics, for me lyrics are important. ... Strangely I do not find the music of my youth compelling, only more recent music does it for me. ... I think Lonson's comment about hearing the story in instrumental music is what I'm getting at, but without any musical training I'm having a hard time following the story.Very interesting. I know few people who are not driven to keep listening to their past.
I’m not sure Lonson is thinking that music expresses a literal story (although perhaps he does - I hope he will correct me if I am wrong). I think he means that the music has to go somewhere and express something. As a musician, every note you play must go somewhere and lead forward. It must make the listener yearn for the next note.
The primary way to learn the language is just to listen. It is perhaps like watching movies and learning what various edit types, etc. mean. Music is more subtle, but it does reveal itself.
badbeef said This is likely an abuse of the Forums, and a precedent that one shouldn't set.This forum is about PS Audio equipment and music. You posted music. Nicely done.
Elk saidI’m not sure Lonson is thinking that music expresses a literal story (although perhaps he does - I hope he will correct me if I am wrong). I think he means that the music has to go somewhere and express something. As a musician, every note you play must go somewhere and lead forward. It must make the listener yearn for the next note.
That's correct Elk, I didn't mean a literal story exclusively.
For me, sometimes it is a personal connection to a song or music, or being able to empathize with the writer or performer, that is compelling.
Sometimes it is a song’s inexplicable ability to draw an emotional response every time you hear it.
Thanks to Malbeuf’s (Badbeef’s) putting himself out there (well done by the way) I am emboldened to share a link to a performance that is both personal to me (it is my son performing an original song) and emotionally compelling because I know the back story that inspired his lyrics.
Thanks for indulging a proud Papa:
The Hatchback Sessions: Volume I - Jacob Ellis
Cheers!
Scotte1, very nice! You certainly can be proud of your son!