Decware. The Best Amp Ever? Andrew Robinson Seems To Think So

Power and speaker efficiency

I’ve had a real change in thinking about this… in short, I always want power… not just watts into 4 ohms, but current (yes related). Throughout my audio life, this has always served me as you don’t need to worry too much about speaker-amp matching as beefy amps can pretty much do anything.

Now I have these very efficient Focal speakers… hmm… and my Prima Luna integrated HP (high power) does bass so darn well… and Kevin at upscale keeps saying that bass response in tube amps is not about power but the transformers… hmmm… and I watch those vids with Nelson Pass noting most everything is under 1 watt… hmmmm

This all opens quite a bit of opportunities for amps like Decware. But then changing out speakers with an amp like this could be problematic… and expensive.

Peace
Bruce in Philly

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It amazing how well this little amp produces bass.
We’re not talking about “chest thumping” or “pants waving” sound pressure levels that some folks value.
Just convincing, satisfying sound quality.

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And to continue to recall Nelson Pass, he also said something regarding power that makes simple sense. I paraphrase:
If we have two “perfect” amps, one 10 watts and one 1000 watts, below 10 watts they will sound the same…"

All about The Bottom Watts, man…:metal:t3:

Perhaps a way to turn this around is to say that Inefficient Speakers (sorta) Require Big Amps to realize their potential - which is not a Plus. High Power amps are not in and of themselves All Good.

The difference in the topologies - Class D, Class B, A/B and A can be seen in terms of How Many Clean Watts you get out of them at the Bottom. The First Watts. Most applications, even with big speakers and plenty-high volumes - you’re rarely using more than 20 or 30 watts.

So saying that a low-wattage amp won’t run your speakers can be seen more as a reflection on the speaker design and efficiency than as a Problem with the amp.

Steve Deckert is famous for saying “If the first watt sucks, why continue?”

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Perhaps an “I’m ok, you’re ok” perspective is best here. The “problem” is less about any particular design, and more about the inappropriate pairing of amp and speaker.

Are you fishing, or standing on the shore like an idiot? The action is the same, yet one’s interpretation, characterization, or vantage point is the primary variable.

Typically, I’m standing on the shore like an idiot.

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After viewing his Decware review, which was a Rave, I viewed his top ten best speaker review. Andrew’s likes don’t parallel mine. Some solid recommendations and some surprises, several causing me to question his tastes versus mine. Clearly he spells out success with Decware requires additional attention to mating the amplifer with the right high efficiency speaker. In his opinion 95 dB or higher. He specifically liked the Forte IV Heritage series with Decware. I’d like to think there are better partners such as Zu Audio or Devore. My intent was to audition Decware amps and several speakers at his East Peoria facility. Unfortunately emergent issues precluded this. I am working with Sarah to re-schedule. In my opinion speaker selection with Decware as a possibility is critical. I have always wanted to try the High Efficiency SET combination at least once. The trick is to find an uncolored (read flat frequency response from 32 hz to 16k hz range) clean sounding hi efficiency (93db+) speaker.

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Agree on speaker matching, as that’s the trick to success with low power amplifiers. Decware makes for compelling consideration as a value proposition.

Sounds like Nelson Pass too.

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It’s interesting what WILL match well with Decware speakers. I started off with the 2 watt amp and fairly efficient speakers. Then I became intrigued with the Decware “Radial” speaker design, followed that through 4 different models and decide I needed more power, and went to a pair of EL34 monoblocks no longer made, an early version of the Rachel and then a Torii MkII and then a Torii Mk III loving the sound with the HR-1 radial design speakers,

Then 2 things happened. First I bought a Taboo Mk III used as a headphone amp to get more listening time in and please my wife with more quiet for her. I loved that and bought one of the then new Taboo Mk IV which had the excellent UFO transformers. On a lark I fooked that up to the HR-1 (about 93 db) speakers. I fell immediately in love–these had the SET magic of the little amps with their 3 SEP watts that I preferred to the push-pull Torii, and they were plenty loud and dynamic lacking only a bit of bass weight. Steve had just come out with the ZROCK2 and suggested that would fix my problem. . . and it sure did. And then he introduced the 25th Anniversary mods and I took a chance that the SE84UFO3 Monoblocks with those mods would have enough power for the HR-1–and they sure did and the most magic sound I’ve ever heard. Five years ago I never eould have thought the Zen amp would work with these speakers and now I think my weakest link would be sources for a long time to come. Going DOWN in amplifier size is the best audio decision I have made.

And of course, somebody has to say what we all know; that room size, listening distance and how protective your are of your hearing are all parts of the equation.

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True dat.

That Decware amp does sound good. The problem I have with it…and most SET amps like it…is that the low and high ends of the frequency range are rolled off. The midrange is stellar though. I much prefer the sound of Class A or even Class A/B push/pull tube amp. I prefer the KT88 tube to the EL84 tube because the KT88 is better at the low and high end while really not giving up much if anything in the midrange.

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Interesting. I don’t hear the low or the high end rolled off. Not with my isolation treatment, power management, cabling, EQ component and speakers. The high end is more than I need with ribbon tweeters, with EQ boost the bass is fantastic, accurate and tighr with no mush (I have a conrabass violin, an electric version of same, a Fender fretless Jazz, two fretted Jazz, two Precisions, a Bass VI, a Jaquar Baritone, two Wishbass and an Epiphone Jack Casidy–I know bass sounds).

Great. You have your opinion and I have mine. The low end is a bigger issue anyway because my hearing on the high end is not what it used to be. If you are a midrange fanatic, a SET amp is for you!

Whenever I hear someone make these comments about the Decware amps I strongly suspect they have never heard one. These amps DO NOT sound like the typical SET amp at all. They do not have the charcteristic mid-range rich rolled off at the extremes sound that I have heard from Cary amps and I read of other amps. Other Decware owners are welcome to chime in here. . . but the Decware amps don’t sound as you described in your post from two hours ago.

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No, I have a friend that is a huge Decware fan and he has a SE84UFO2. It sounds great. The bass is not what I want from an amp…sorry.

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Like saying 911’s don’t have much cornering grip because a friend’s doesn’t. Really? Tires? Alignment? …? Ya know…

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