Interesting - I’ve just put in a pair of AP Crystals to trial…
How much better are the Belden’s ? And any idea who’s distributing in Oz.
My cables deliberation must come to an end very soon, probably got a week.
tony22 said Interesting read, GM. I have been very impressed with the sound of the Devialet gear at shows, although I've never heard it in a "real" listening room. Your opportunity to hear it and the DS in very similar systems must have been a great experience.Hi Tony
The way this particular place is set-up blows me away. Today, they were busy for quite a while, but that is no burden, because though I wasn’t listening today, just walking around and looking in each room is enough to remind one of what was heard there.
For sheer physical presence (let alone the cost) : Chord SPM MkII 140000 Monoblocks, Chord CPA 8000 pre-amp, Vivid Giya speakers, and Gold Analysis Plus cables. Playing soft jazz.
For pure musical delight : Karan amplifiers (no negative feedback loop; massive bandwidth - to assist with dealing with the harmonics; and monster power) and pre-amp driving Kharma DB9-S speakers.
And back to planet earth : a room full of B&W speakers with Devialet 800 Mono’s; and a room full of Audio Physic speakers with another set of Devialet 400 Mono’s + PS Audio Directstream (which they’ll move to other rooms as required).
Everyroom is well set-up with full treatment and i’ve never noticed a bad room effect there. PS Audio power regenerators throughout.
I guess they can easily identify my online persona now…
… but, seriously, best dealer in Sydney, Australia ( just PM me for details, very happy to recommend them to anyone ) - I’ve been there quite a lot recently and since I’m always happy to wait, I can confirm they are professional, courteous and thorough with every type of client.
Perversely, being forced to chase all over Sydney for PS Audio gear (you’ve really got to want to hear it) was a blessing in disguise. Ended up in my home town, which is nothing like when I grew up there, except it is still a long way from the city, and found an amazing array of HiFi kit.
If you want used equipment, then there’s one other place to visit, but that’s an altogether different business model. 4 box DCS Debussy stack; Gryphon 150W Class A colosseum amp + array of speakers; massive Horn speakers way taller than my 6 ft; TAD reference speakers; a number of Constellation amps; and my rather modest in comparison Salon2’s (which no longer live there).
Had a fabulous time so far.
Now looking forward to revisiting lots and lots of my music over time, and also finding out favourites of lots of people and listening to those. I grew up with grunge, but used to subscribe to the Recital Piano and Sydney Symphony as well.
Got too busy with work for a long time - which was probably necessary, since from what I can tell, no part of this “hobby” is cheap… (as someone that started with $1/m speaker wire and hoped that would get the job done for me).
GM
Green Machine said Interesting - I've just put in a pair of AP Crystals to trial...How much better are the Belden’s ? And any idea who’s distributing in Oz.
My cables deliberation must come to an end very soon, probably got a week.
Hi GM,
they are not being distributed in Oz, atm they are only being sold in USA. The same company will be handling international sales. I’ve contacted then once for details about sales to Oz via their website but as yet not had a reply. Check the thread on the cables for the company doing sales in USA as I’ve forgotten who they are.
Regards. Frank
My curiosities run rampant with Devialet’s tight-fisted trickle-down doling out of, in many cases “rushed” upgrades. Take SAM for example; if they can build a ‘box’ that makes it possible for dealers to tune specific speakers, how long before we see someone else CNC a box available to anyone with the money that can do the same thing? Some might think that unlikely as Devialet retains control over their intellectual property. But did the likes of Porsche, Audi, Ferrari, Ford and Chevrolet not have similar protections in place near 20 years ago when people started making stand-alone engine management for those cars? The worst any of those manufacturers could inflict was to violate the warranty of a car in its warranty period using stand-alone or having an ‘aftermarket’ chip installed. While I certainly don’t have the expertise required to do this there’s a bazillion young geek-types out there playing video games all day that do. I’m also convinced that if this just dawned on me last night that there must be dozens, if not hundreds of those types already hunkered down at workbenches around the world, soldering-guns-in-hand, wanting to be the MoTeC and Haltech of Devialet stand-alone ‘engine’ management.
Hanson AV in Dayton, Ohio. Ask for Andres Sauceda. My understanding is that they are just now beginning to take orders for the Belden line.
As for the Oval 12’s… not really any competition. Another forum member is ordering a set. I’ll let him chime in if he wants.
Very interesting to me.
The Crystal 8’s have more low-end than previous AP+, and the same apparent clarity on voice and strings, but I’m almost convinced the Crystal’s are frequency shifting (upwards) and also dampening noise and signal.
Will run Kubala Sosna Expressions vs Crystals off the same amplifier to my two sets of speakers tomorrow (two Revel Salon2’s on one side, and two PSB Sync Ones on the other). Shifting balance or interconnects. (believe have found a couple of Directstream software bugs, which I’ll write up elsewhere, later - one where the balance control will freeze).
I’ve found that listening just off axis to each driver in turn, using a mono speaker arrangement (one channel), is the quickest way to isolate key differences in a reliable fashion.
(btw, running four speakers off two mono blocks started as an experiment based on something Doug Schneider tried & wrote about with two sets of affordable electrostatics, which he had heard described as being akin to a ‘poor man’s Infinity’ (60k in the 80’s, per his note; and a fair bit more now for the company doing what appears to my eye to be the successor / survivor speakers. Maybe Genesis, I forget. Obviously got my attention. Originally was seeing whether incoherence was common when bi-cabling with two sets of different cables; again Doug said he’d experimented with it, but ultimately found the approach to produce incoherent sound).
Interested to know about any preferred testing methodologies more experienced members (everyone else) utilise. With thanks in advance.
Presently, I’d miss the extra definition in strings provided by AP Crystals, but it just doesn’t seem like a natural sound to me, in total.
Obviously PS Audio disagrees, as the Crystal just on show with BHk’s in Munich. Makes me curious what cables Arnie Nudell would “voice” with the amplifiers; voicing a product would be complicated enough without allowing for endless variations in cables on top of the candidate DAC / AMP.
GM-
Just wanted to let you know I got the Devialet 200 today after enduring every shipping snafu imaginable. To top it off I transplanted over 70 potted plants today and hauled over 300lbs of potting soil up to a 2nd floor terrace. Then UPS shows with it even tho tracking showed it wouldn’t be here till tomorrow. But I accepted it anyway tho knew I didn’t have it in me to read the manual and set it up perfectly. I tried and kept finding myself skimming over the words for paragraphs at a time then realizing I hadn’t absorbed a single word due to fatigue. So I found a sliver of reprieve that said; “skip to page 10 to play immediately with default settings.” That’s all I needed/wanted today… just something to tide me over till tomorrow when I’m fresh and can understand technical writing again.
2.5 hours later I can share this much. Even right outta the box and nowhere near burned in its at least as good as the system it replaces! If the DirectStream is better detailed its by a single percentage point or three and that was my biggest reservation of the entire upgrade. My old system even tho only 6-7 months old should’ve wiped the floor with the Devialet WPC-wise (350 vs ~270@4 ohms) but doesn’t. Much MUCH larger sound stage with Devialet and scarey-uncanny woofer control. My woofers have never sounded this big, tight, articulate and most importantly controlled. And tho I can’t say for sure but since this is a default setting just to get the system up & running I doubt there’s any SAM effect in place. The beryllium tweets have never displayed such twinkle, shimmer or performed so seamlessly. And all this from Rev 7.1.0 with 7.1.1, 7.1.3 and 8.0 already released tho I’ll likely wait for 8.1.0 and skip 8.0 altogether due to some ‘bugginess’ I don’t wanna trifle with. I’ll give each a fair audition to determine preference. I could live with things as they are right now forever and be perfectly content that this was an incredible upgrade after 400-500 hours burn in. And I’ll be sure to save this particular Rev specification so I can go back to it if I get lost in the 3-4 subsequent Rev upgrades when I venture there. Wall mount adapter plate should arrive in a week or two then I can mount it permanently on the wall behind my desk
The remote is truly elegant, exquisite and being RF such a pleasure to use. Total Rolex! The one complaint, if you can call it that is “quad” shipping boxes… a box in a box in a box in a box and any one of them alone would’ve been sufficient all the way from France. Double/triple shipping boxes are fine but four is a little much. But if I ever sell I’ll pay it forward. If for no reason other than bragging rights.
I’ll catch up again in another week or so with a more detailed description once I’ve more deeply explored this whole other universe.
Wonderful fun. Congratulations!
I adore high quality remotes. Yes, a cheap remote works as well and does not improve the sound, but aesthetically a gorgeous remote is such a delight - just like a high quality volume knob.
Heheh so true and a gorgeous remote WITH a high quality volume knob is win-win! Especially when it feels like this one while turning! Drop-dead STUNNING piece!
Thanks Manoet
Your enthusiasm is wonderful to read. It’s a wonderful bit of kit & it’s already obvious you’ve made the right decision.
The remote is a cracking bit of kit - beautiful finish, nice weight, and the knob dial very nice, too. Devialet have definitely nailed fully automated production (by robots, in france). You can set up SAM so that it switches on / off via the remote; I’m sure you’ll appreciate demonstrating the massive difference it makes.
Looking forward to hearing all your thoughts on the Devialet.
Congrats… My 200 replaced a Direct Stream and a very well setup Ayon amp… Mine too sounded quite good out of the box and continued to improve as time went on 3-400 hours… There’s not much tweaking to do to a Devialet but they do respond well to good power cords and power line conditioning…Anyway welcome to the club and enjoy.
erikm-
Thanks and I’m coming to the similar conclusion that although there’s a l-o-t of adjustment available, once you’re there, you’re there and no further tweaking is desired or beneficial. But far better to have all those adjustments and never use them than need them, even if only once, and not have them! I too am a big believer in both power cords, speaker cables and IC’s. All mine are Crystal Cable Dreamline or Ultra and terminated with Furutech Carbon Fiber Rhodium AC/IEC, RCA and bananas into a custom passive conditioner with Furutech GTX-D Rhodium plated solid copper outlets. Sadly my carbon fiber IEC housing doesn’t fit under the Devialet rear cover so I’m running without the cover. I have a wall mount coming and when I install that the rear of the Devialet will be lower than the top of my roll top desk and won’t matter that its missing. Today I turned the treble/bass up 1dB then shifted balance a click or two to the left and now things sound better than has ever come from these speakers! I was a little skeptical initially as I bought the new Devialet totally unseen/unheard but today am confident this is the REAL DEAL! When its right, no I mean really REALLY right you can tell… its immediate and as much feeling as critical impression. Sometimes ya jus get lucky!
It is kind of a pain the rear cover won’t fit with most power cords but supposedly it sounds better off, which is how mine is. I also found that for my room about 3db of bass boost at 70hz worked a treat. It’s great one can adjust so many little parameters! And the new firmware is awesome… I’ve started to down load a few DSD files and they sound excellent!
I can no longer in fair conscience abide by the forum title to this thread, ie: Devialet Vs DirectStream Dac. Its now abundantly clear Devialet is so much more than a DAC and comparing it solely against a DirectStream DAC is hardly fair. While I still contend the DS is flat-out the best component I ever heard in my old (if 7 months can be considered old) system and in the top 3 best-sounding components I’ve EVER purchased it simply cannot compete with the Devialet. A less lop-sided challenge might be the PSA DS with BHK and a pre with and the upcoming sound card II. Least that way we’re comparing apples-to-apples with single manufacturer’s model of amp, pre, DAC & streamer.
Yes the Devialet is good. Great in fact! Maybe the best I’ve ever heard and certainly the best I’ve ever heard in my home! Even a few audio-related friends I have agree after a marathon 12 hour listening session Friday. I couldn’t get them to leave! My fear of losing some measure of musical detail when adding Devialet and deleting DS was totally unfounded. In fact the Devialet would completely dominate that system if played side-by-side. But I’ll be quick to point out that does NOT mean the Devialet DAC is in and of itself better or more detailed, and this where where the ‘unfairness’ comes into play. When I added the DS I was stunned at the amount of detail I was hearing. Things I’ve never heard before. Heard them on virtually everything I streamed at 24/96 as for 6 months my reclocked Sonos has been my ONLY source and I’d prefer to continue that trend. Years ago I appreciated and heard 24/192 but hearing tests at the VA hospital have confirmed too much hearing loss “incurred in and/or aggravated by munitions & ordinance during 2.5 tours in Viet Nam in the mid-60’s.” Installed the Devialet and 40 hours later I was hearing profound increased detail again. And again on everything streamed! Relentless increase and in even greater detail than the DS provided.
The Devialet is now at 94 hours of continuous play and has shown only slight improvement over the past 30 or so hours. At the listening party Friday where as you would expect they brought their own CDs and transports no one thought additional break-in would be of any benefit and they unanimously agree this is likely the best they’ve heard as well. Kinda flattering for me to hear when one of them has over $150k invested in his primary system and was our reigning champion for years. To go from 5th to 1st overnight is a humbling experience when all I did was stumble into it. Via texts and phone calls since Friday I think we all have learned some things. Reevaluated some long-held beliefs, redefined some biases and are ready to embrace some previously unconsidered options.
What I’ve personally noticed is an incredible transparency, resolution, tone/texture, delicacy, see-thru clarity, liveliness with astonishing realism. Highest fidelity, fullest range, most transparent-to-source system I’ve ever owned or heard in my home. A FAR better integrated system than I’ve ever been able to duplicate even back in the height of my career when price was no object and I could throw $75k at speakers etc.
Funny story; I kept wondering why Devialet sent me a custom-sized soft-padded tote bag with handles. I mean who transports their amp, pre & DAC around in a bag!?! One of my audio friends knew EXACTLY what to do with it… load the Devialet in it and take it around to high-end hifi shops to test other components with it, ie; sources, speakers et al. DOH… never even thought of that!
Manoet,
Thank you for this thoughtful post. You are absolutely right that the Devialet is much more than a DAC. It would indeed be interesting to compare the Devialet with a system comprised of a DS Dac, BHK amp, and the forthcoming Bridge II and PSA pre-amp; not 100% apples to apples, but much closer.
Thank you for accepting this in the spirit intended. I seriously considered letting this post fade away as I was afraid it would be perceived as gloating and didn’t want it to go that way. But within a day or two it became pretty obvious there was an unfair advantage at play. And painfully so to have to update this thread. I do agree however that an “as-close-to” comparison of Devialet vs PSA’s latest/greatest tri-component set when available would be fun. My gut-level hunch is you’d have to also include/compare same speaker(s)/source(s) set or two, power cord(s), cable(s) in a neutral venue to further level the playing field. Do it double-blind and let the cards fall where they may. I’m game when its available! I even have a little tote bag for “ALL” my gear! 
Your posts strikes me as perfectly appropriate. You are sharing your experience. I think we all appreciate it is not apples to apples, but apples to entire produce section.
Love the Post Manoet,
I did find my 200 got better over a few weeks and months not a lot, but better. What version firmware are you on? A lot of folks love the 7.1.3 beta, and the new 8.0 is really good (and adds DSD capability) in fact either is better than 7.1.1 which is most likely what you have if you didn’t upgrade … easy enough to check.
And I agree comparing a Devialet to a Direct Stream is silly since the Devialet isn’t just a Dac but a totally integrated solution.
And FYI I’m using both a Aurender N100H and a W4S modded Sonos as sources…The Devialet AIR streamer is really good but a bit fussy… But sound quality with a separate top notch streamer is amazing!
Dunno what happened… just typed a response, clicked a smiley then submit reply and GONE!
So the shorter version: Since my Dev just got here Wednesday its running the current “shipped” FW, ie; 7.1.2 and I’m in no hurry to upgrade especially at the 8.0 level tho may dabble with 7.1.3 beta in a couple weeks. Truth is with just my 24/96 Sonos and unSAMable speakers I have little-to-no interest in lots of bells, buzzers and adjustments. Besides, the sound is so friggin incredible I’m afraid to even turn it off that something may change! All my friends that were over on Friday said “don’t touch it… don’t change ANYTHING!!”
I too am running an uber high-end power cord, one digital coax (Sonos) and speaker cables. Thats it… 6 total! All Crystal Cables Ultra and Dreamline with Furutech Carbon Fiber Rhodium plated terminations and costing more than twice as much in 2009 as I spent on my house in 1986! True story but GAWD they’re good! 97% solid core 5n silver mixed with 3% 24K gold then extruded with Kapton coating. Tons of other equipment has come & gone but my Crystal Cables are lifetime! Even now that I’m not using many I originally purchased there’s no way I’d sell them! My most coveted audio possession!
Manoet said Dunno what happened... just clicked a smiley then submit reply and GONE!See this topic: http://www.psaudio.com/forum/new-forum-issues/disappearing-posts/