While I appreciate your candid opinion, the resurgence of vinyl is not being driven by audiophile elites with their $20,000 tone arms. It’s being driven by the unwashed audio masses who find nothing remotely wrong with low bitrates MP3’s. Driven by those who know nothing more than the audio Yaris, and who could care less about dynamic range, or soundstage, or imaging.
And it’s the Everyman quality of vinyl that has piqued my interest, not well intentioned audiophile snobbery
I fully agree that the vinyl resurgence is not driven by high end, I just say that it’s neither driven by sound quality aspects but instead by lifestyle and haptics aspects
In this scenario you simply should have fun playing around with vinyl independent of quality related or other dramatic sound differences, otherwise you might be disappointed not to find the holy grail. Within the everyman vinyl resurgence, it’s mainly about fun, not sound quality imo.
Looking forward to your decision on a turntable. You have had more than a few strong recommendations, time to dip your toe in the water. I can add this about vinyl, I have rebuilt budget turntables from the 70’s placed a reasonable phono cartridge on it and donated it to friends who have considered vinyl but (1) did not have the means to purchase it, (2) were hesitant to dive in, and (3) were curious as to what all the hub bub was about. They tend to have reasonable mid-fi systems.
The most recent example was a rebuilt Philips GA-312 with a Grado F3+. The recipient was first taken by the look and control feature. Playing vinyl and comparing to their digital playback they were taken by the sound of vinyl In this instance he preferred the vinyl over his digital system. We immediately went out crate digging, and picked up a handful of LPs at a local thrift store.
An eminently valid reason to explore vinyl (and may I go so far as to say an admirable one, too), but also one that obviates the need to address the question in the thread title.
After absorbing all of this, I’m leaning in the direction of the Rega P2 which seems to be the minimum entry point to a true Rega. The Fluance RT85 being the other contender. Fluance has a lot of positive YouTube reviews, and it’s obvious Fluance sent out a bunch of free decks to obtain the “unbiased” (yawn) reviews.
One question about the Rega P2. What happens when the needle gets to the end of the record? Does it stop? Does the tone arm return it neatly to the side? Does the turntable stop spinning? Or must one be on-guard and rush over to prevent the needle from charging on into the label?
Just wondering how hands on it is. My old 1970’s cheapo turntable, long since in the landfill, would neatly return the needle back to the side. Is this how things work?
It’s a manual turntable. The last (run out) groove is a closed circle so it will sit there quietly going ‘thabump’ at 33 rpm until you lift the arm and return it to the arm rest. No worries about hitting the label, just unnecessary needle wear if left there for hours.
As I recall from my early days, fully automatic turntables (not to be confused with changers) will, at the press of a button, turn on the drive, pick up the arm and set it down at the start of the record, pick it up at the end, and return it to its rest. Semi-automatics pick up at the end and may or may not return it to the rest. Manuals (which predominate in today’s market) require you to do all the work, and if the idea of popping up right away to lift the stylus from the runout grooves bothers you, you can buy aftermarket stylus lift mechanisms.
Do I understand correctly there is no damage done by the ThaBump if remedied within 10 minutes (arbitrary time)? But damage could happen if left thabumping all night?
The Fluance actually stops spinning once the thabump starts.
You should lift the arm as soon as possible. Vinyl starts slightly melting after a several revolutions at the same groove. It soils the needle and damages the groove (the latter doesn’t mind in runout area).
But nothing will burn if you leave it
“When this concentration of pressure upon the points of contact is calculated, we find it to be approximately 26 tons per square inch. The walls of the record grooves are, of course, subject to the same pressure, but only for the fraction of a second required for a particular section to move past the tip as the record rotates.”
I’m most familiar with DAC lingo. For instance, in the DAC world, and speaking in generalities, Benchmark is more analytical. Border Patrol and HoloSpring are the opposite, they are warm, with PS Audio somewhere in between.
Are these principle also true of turntables? Does Rega have a house sound and pro-ject another? If yes, where do they rank on the spectrum?
Music Hall is another brand I can easily access. Are they a good brand? And what’s their house sound?
I have not owned a Rega Planar1, 2, or 3 nor a Music Hall. That said my experience with the P8 is it tends to be accurate, light on it’s feet and very musical. I would not describe it as analytical nor warm. The Regas do have a house sound that is lighter, and the Planar 1,2, and 3 have been known to run slightly fast which contributes to that sound. For your price range Rega sets the standard and will be here for the long term. Music Hall is a reasonable alternative. I’m sure you know that the phono cartridge is a major contributor to the sound. In your price range an d for your preference of a less analytical sound the previously mentioned Nagaoka MP-110 on a Rega is the ticket. Definitely not an Audio Technica or Sumiko. An option for a Rega Could be a Grado Prestige, personally I’m not sure if it is a good match. There is quite a bit that goes into selecting a cartridge for a particular tonearm. Mating a cartridge to a tonearm and phono stage is critical. Focus on the overall package in a price range you are comfortable with. Don’t get hung up with the audio jargon, at this level as it will confuse your selection. This is why I had suggested you discuss it with a retailer that caries the turntable you are likely to buy.
There is a website with a bunch of older audiophiles who are very familiar with and have owned the turntables you are interested in. I suggest giving them a shot as well. Just understand two things, everyone has an opinion and free advice is worth…
You are bound to get as many recommendations as there are turntable owners.
Music Hall uses parts, which are offered bei ProJect. Mr. Hall fits them together for his own gusto and does that nicely.
What I recommended before - the ProJect X1, better X2, I would prefer myself over the Regas. Benefits are for instance: Carbon/Aluminium arm, VTA/azimuth adjustment, electronic speed control (= better sound as well), better bearing, damped motor, better cable etc… It’s really well done!
Against the opinion of some here (and as result from my personal experience and selling audio gear to “well educated” customers for thirty years) I would not state, that You have to double or triple the costs of Your digital setup to reach the same quality with analog. I’ve sold many PS Combos (14.000€ - 15.000€ incl. Bridge in Europe) to VERY happy customers (and myself ). Many of them still own a nice LP collection. When they asked me for an adequate affodable TT to their now very good digital gear, I mostly sold them a model for about 8000€ including cartridge. Pretty all of them still state: “The PS DMP/DS are really great, and I enjoy them immensley…but playing a good record ist still in another league”.