What's the Goal of a High Performance System?

The system should make your toes tap, fingers drum, head bob and give you a smile at almost any listening volume on any type of music. The speakers themselves should disappear as if the sound is not coming from them. If not than the synergy between the pieces and the room are way off. You may not be able to change the room much but you can change the pieces until you get the sound you are looking for. I am thinking that the speakers may be the issue as that is the end of the chain of components. A long time ago I had a set of expensive KEF reference speakers and hated them FWIW. I have less than $20k in my entire system and it sounds pretty damn good to me. I donā€™t really care if it is a perfect reproduction of the recording engineers vision but if I like the sound then its OK.You are the only one that needs to feel good about it as it is your hobby and passion.

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Since so many have nicely spelled out a lot of the reasons WHY we do it, but mostly avoided recommending anything, Iā€™ll wade in. A bunch of my personal opinions based on a lifetime of experience. YMMV - weā€™re all different and actually not only have different goals, but hear differently both with our ears in a measurable way, but with our brains.

I would second the suggestions that you have to start with the room.

If you are stuck with it, you need to figure out what you can do to fix it. While a certain amount of clutter can help with diffusion, take a look at the majority of the System thread photos. The speakers are mostly not large for the room. It sounds like yours may be - at least, unless you remove everything else, including the surround system, all of the drivers of which are acting as passive resonators, muddying the picture - (see the suggestions of Jim Smith). The Rooms also tend not to be cluttered.

Mine is currently more cluttered than anything Iā€™ve had to deal with for the past 30 years or so, as I moved into an apartment 1/4 the size of my old house. A bigger space is ultimately on the agenda - but I got this place for reasons other than my stereo (and HT, which is in the boxes. Nowhere to put it).

You are looking for Synergy - stuff that works together, and work With the room. I did custom install work for a while, and it was a common issue that people would buy random stuff that they had heard was good - not necessarily that plays well together. ā€œI spent X - why isnā€™t it satisfying?ā€ was a common refrain. The answer was that they were unwilling to listen to any recommendations that went against what they wanted to do (we can all be that way) and bought certain shiny brands or items they wanted to own, and did not or could not or would not do ANYTHING to accomodate that shiny stuff to the room.

Mac/PS/KEF sounds like something that would not hang together to me - but thatā€™s me, and thatā€™s a guess, not having heard your system. Not to say it couldnā€™t be made to work if given the space, room treatment and setup. However, in a small room, good two-ways with musical (not typical HT) subs can work much better than larger speakers. Large speakers in a small room is Node Hell. And BTW - IMO, you cannot fix it with DSP. You are screwing up the sound coming out of your speakers to try and fix an acoustical isssue, which is adding insult to injury.

Again - my opinions only, take with a healthy dose of your choice of gourmet salt. Paul can help you make the right choice with that ; )

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I got a great laugh out of that one! Iā€™ve only encountered a few women in m life and experience that really appreciated this hobby and resulting systems, and they werenā€™t interested in me. And Iā€™ve had a lovely (late) first wife, and now have a lovely second wife. . . who love me despite my hobby!

The music draws me in and seduces me. I used to perform and practice on musical instruments, and when I quit playing improving a stereo system was my way to get a similar thrill from music. Itā€™s a rabbit hole to a wonderland. . . and a sort of madness. I now both connect deeply with the thousands of discs I have (so many that I have to keep a third of them in a storage unit!) and also revel in the tiny subtleties such as swapping one sixty year old tube for another and marveling at changes.

The goal for me is to build and maintain a system that lets me listen to all my collection when I can and get lost in the music. I get closer and closer.

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Re: Shahinian Diapason Thanks for mentioning those, never saw or heard of them before. The speakers Iā€™ve owned and listened to the last eighteen years or so, Decware ERR and HR-1 are omni-directional (ERR) and combination omni-directional and directional (HR-1) and I LOVE them and build my systems around them. Once I got a taste of what these do, conventional speakers seem lacking to me.

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Thatā€™s exactly my experience. When I listen to a conventional box speaker they fail to create the illusion of realism like an omni-directional speaker does.

My late mom was the inspiration that led me to omni-directional loudspeakers. Mom was an accomplished violinist and she taught the instrument to others. Mom had no interest in HiFi because (her words) they, HiFi loudspeakers in general, ā€œthey do not sound like real instruments, the tone is all wrong as is the timbre and colour of the instruments"

She dismissed ā€˜everythingā€™ until she heard Shahinian Obelisks. I couldnā€™t believe it as she sat still with her eyes closed without uttering a single word until the record finished. Vaughan Williams: Tallis Fantasia:

I bought her the Obelisks and the rest of the equipment to go with them. Mary played music everyday through the Obelisks and thoroughly enjoyed the experience right up to her death. I still use the speakers in a second system.

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Thanks for sharing that. I agree with her assessment of the omnidirectional character.

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The big MBLs are like that - at many shows, after rooms full of crap/congested sound, you walk into some of their rooms, and itsā€¦ā€œNOW weā€™re talkingā€¦ā€. Mostly only ever really liked the big ones. Sadly godforsaken amount of money though.

Heard the Diapasonā€˜s nearly 40 years ago in music lessons in school (these were the speakers used in the music classroom). The dynamics and the realism independent of the listeners position were a really great experience at the time, unmatched by anything else. Didnā€™t hear them since thenā€¦not sure if Iā€™d like to pass on imaging used from directional speakers now.

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That maybe a futile goal, because I have heard a few times, that women are non audiophiles. On the other hand, an impression may occur if you leave your checkbook and credit cards on a speaker for her visual enjoyment. :smile:
I stand corrected in the case of Dirkā€™s mom. And he is a wonderful son.

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Whatā€™s that?

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I will ask my wife :wink:

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I have been in the MBL room at a couple different audio shows and I agree, the top of the line model created that magic and the lesser models, not so much. What are they, $250K?

I am also a big fan of omni-directionals. I acquired a pair of Hegeman Model 1aā€™s designed by Stu Hegeman, who like Lincoln Walsh, was one of the earlier omni speaker pioneers. They have been fully restored from top to bottom and are truly marvelous in so many ways. They simply do things that monopole speakers cannot. I also have a set of monopoles that I thoroughly enjoy - also doing things the Model 1aā€™s cannot. I enjoy both sets - depending on the music and mood.

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If it doesnā€™t wow you first, itā€™s hard that it will wow anybody. Synergy is a pursuit until akin to dieting, one can lose weight and look well on the outside while feeling like crap and being unhealthy on the inside. My setup gave me chills first, then when shared with others, it did the same. The magic comes with experience in knowing the combo that delivers such magic. That is sometimes achieved at a very low cost. Throwing money to it from the getgo and getting great synergy is sometimes luck.

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I feel that especially with the HR-1 one does not have to take a pass on imaging, and even with the ERR (now ERRx) with their adjustable directional tweeter imaging is very good.

Important question, Roy. Most of us have limited resources; time , money, concentration etc. And we canā€™t separate our ears from our emotions. If our system is flat, uninvolving or even annoying and this was not the case in the past I think a look inward is warranted. Music can lift us up, take us out of this world for awhile but it is unlikely to repair a frayed relationship , uninspiring job or spiritual emptiness. One danger in this audio thing is isolation. To much time in the ā€œsweet spotā€ and not enough spent with others we care about can turn our ears sour.

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So very well put!

Relationship is a two way concept.

I am certain my systems like me.

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Great post.

Iā€™ve come to understand this and to reflect on it. Actually to the point of having decided to ā€˜retireā€™ my small, acoustically treated, dedicated room in the basement. Iā€™ll repurpose it as a storage room and put my whole setup up in the living room.

Not a cool thing for one to isolate oneself from the rest of the family and not have them participate, be around the music, familiarise themselves etc. As opposed to have ā€˜Dad be left alone as he is down in the basementā€™ I am going for spending time with my 12 year old boy, educating him on some Jimi or some Cui, Borodin, Mussorgsky etc as I help him with his homework. Even if this means sonic / acoustic compromises are going to be made.

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The very reason why I choose to have my listening room in my living room. I could do better in a dedicated room, aurally speaking, but Ive got four others in the household I prefer not to alienate myself from at this point in my life. Some day, that dedicated room will happen for me. Now is just not the right time.

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