Anyone using power conditioning upstream of Powerplant?

Over and over again, time after time you guys are repeatedly redundant again. :D

I could not have said it better myself.
I could not have said it better myself.


( Is there an echo in here?) :-S

Yes, indeed… But depends on your definition of power conditioning. This is broad terminology. My first line of “power conditioning” & defense is a Richard Gray 6KW (220 to 120V) Isolation Transformer to mechanically disconnect my system from the rest of the electrical world and all of its electrical pollution. It also provides some level of lighting strike protection, the theory being a surge would only travel on one side of the primary winding, and never making it to the secondary. Hope it’s never put to the test (however, on my power meter outside I also have a large current rated surge shunt clamp which I rent monthly from the power company). Parallelled to the Isolation Transformer is the Richard Gray 600S Parallel Choke giving me plenty of current on demand. This “IsoGray” system in turn feeds two P5’s, ie one P5 dedicated solely to each tube monoblock amplifier, and one P500, which feeds all of my source components. So yes, there are options upstream of a P whatever…

Very nice systems Jaynemo and Blueknight. Hard to see how either of you could have any more power problems at all!

I will pay only if I ever have to move the X-former again-at 130 lbs-ouch… (Oh and I stand to correct myself-it’s a 4KW).

@jaynemo I am not going to comment on the RGP parallel chokes because my opinion of these is perhaps well known - and besides - if it works, use it!



I will comment on the isolation transformer and the notion that “mechanically disconnect my system from the rest of the electrical world and all of its electrical pollution”. Sorry, but this just isn’t true, you are coupled magnetically to the power, all its problems and pollutions - and just added another pollution to the mix.



While it is true that an isolation transformer decouples the hard wire connection between the transformer on the electrical utility feeding your home - which basically gives you two transformers in series - and it disconnects you physically from your neighbors - but it doesn’t disconnect you from anything they do or that happens on the line.



The magnetic coupling of an isolation transformer is 1:1 meaning that whatever happens on the primary side is passed along to the secondary side. The only reduction possible in this arrangement is from common mode issues if the isolation transformer is connected to your 220 volt side - which it is likely it is not. Connected to your single ended 120 volt single phase power, you get little if any reduction of common mode noises.



Lastly, isolation transformers tend to add distortion under load. The good news is that apparently your RGP transformer is huge at 6kW and you probably never demand enough from it to increase distortion.



I think it is a product that perhaps helps just a little for eliminating the high frequency stuff that can’t pass through the transformer, but other than that I don’t see a lot of benefit.

Interesting question.



I’ve done three types of filtering. First are parallel filter chokes, Hammond 193L and 193M as suggested in a number of threads on the Audio Asylum a few years back and I believe are similar to those used in the RGPs.



The second type are ferrite clamps on power cords of appliances and other equipment that have SMPS’s in the house… microwave, washer, dryer, DVD players, TVs, all the extension cords where phone / tablet / PC power supplies or chargers are plugged in, etc.



The third are a couple types of parallel filters, a couple from Bruce Brisson’s DIY Audio Kits and several Audioprism Quietlines (I suspect the Noise Harvesters would work well here too). One of the DIY Audio Kits filters is on the same AC circuit as the P10, the others are on other circuits in the house, placed somewhat by ear… I originally used a few more than now and did not like that as much.



While the P10 made a HUGE difference in the sonics of my system and improved the sound quality above anything I had before, adding other conditioning upstream still produced significant additional improvements, especially when applied at the sources of problems (i.e. chokes on the cords of noise-producing appliances and equipment).



Still, they are secondary improvements that are not as significant as that produced by the P10.



I also tried the P10 plugged into a PS Audio Soloist and preferred it direct into the wall, which gives me greater dynamics and bass power with only a tiny increase in noise.



Sadly, I don’t have dedicated lines in this house yet… I did them in a previous house and was VERY impressed with the improvements. I suspect dedicated lines plus the P10 would be a very effective match.



Greg in Mississippi

?... My first line of "power conditioning" & defense is a Richard Gray 6KW (220 to 120V) Isolation Transformer to mechanically disconnect my system from the rest of the electrical world and all of its electrical pollution....


Why are you dropping the voltage?

I realize that this is an old thread, but I am busy getting my feet wet here at this site. “Things should be simple as possible, but not simpler.” Or at least I think that is what Albert E. said. Given that, I followed each section of my incoming power, starting at the the transformer at the pole, and di what I could to deal with each. Talk about giving the PS300 less to deal with! First, I made the city change out all for secondary feeding the 4 houses on my block. They were from the 30’s and ran through trees. The transformer was new so that was allright. Secondly, I had the fuse panel and mast changed out to modern standards, and made sure that the feed was copper, even though the secondary from the pole was aluminum(you can only do so much). I then grounded the panel to the well casing for my well, better than ANY ground rod that I know of. Then, I ran a dedicated line to the system, and bingo, no more excuses. As an aside, this was all done as much for the fact that I do woodworking and welding in my shop. You got to start with the basics if you can. I was lucky. As far as putting anything else in line with the PS300, why would you second guess it’s design?

Great setup.



I also have my panel grounded to my well. I am comfortable this is as good as a ground can get.

Elk,



Old habits die hard. I used to work for Bell System(remember them?) and for a few years, we dealt with radio sites. I don’t have to tell you that there probably nothing better grounded than a radio site! Anyway, it seemed good practice to me, and I try to use what I learned there to make right, things that we have to work with as far as AC is concerned.

I remember Ma. :slight_smile:



I can only imagine how well a radio tower is grounded.

Getting to the groundwater is the name of the game. A dry ground is a bad ground. Sounds like you guys have it made. B-)

It was like preparing for Armageddon man. Ground RINGS were run around the entire building inside. And as always in a telephone building, you had big nasty ground busses, divided into two sections. One for switching equipment only and the rest for practically everything else. You had double redundant power(power generator, and then BIG BIG batteries). Power distribution systems that would blow your mind, with destination tags at EACH end. There’s more but I will have to double up my meds if I relive it all.

There is one thing that I would like to add relevant to the OP. Bell System didn’t use conditioning as such to deal with noise anyway. You see, it all was ‘filtered’ by those giant batteries in the basement. Nothing got past them. The reason that this should sound familiar is that the PS Audio regenerators partially rely on the same thinking. Since we primarily used negative DC voltage, many other things were different.

Oh the days of the Bell System. I worked for C&P Telephone and TL-1 TM2 analog radio. Those were the days fighting the winter snow storms to get into the remote towers across the West Virginia Mountains.

If your still wanting to try the sound conditioner tboooe, I have a couple of Hi-End Monster conditioners I’ll sell you

Yup, things were very different then, and we couldn’t imagine them changing as they did. Tip and ring forever.

Hey, on this forum it’s strictly tip, ring, sleeve. ;))

What about mono lovers?

Ha! You got me, but in outside plant, where I mostly worked, it was just tip and ring.



We, gentlemen, are the last of a great technology. I only got to work for Bell for about 5 years before the break up. After that, it eventually became a new company…and then another…one that I wasn’t so proud to admit working for. In spite of it all, I maintained the same curiosity about the magic of basic electricity.