Ask Paul, he knows who I am or can look at my account.
No, I am not Amir and have no personal or professional association with him.
I think they draw straws to see who comes over next. I don’t know if it’s when they draw the short straw or the long one.
[Once again speaking for myself and not representing PS Audio.]
3 Likes
Sorry, I’ve been away and lost track, so can you just summarise for me in about 10,000 words why you don’t like PS Audio and their products.
2 Likes
Hey @Glimmie perhaps it’s the verbiage being used. You might know them by a different name. We refer to them as flat topped sine waves and they are quite common. Anyone with a Power Plant using its built in scope can see them should they exist.
They happen because, as you know, our homes are synchronized to the power line. Which means we’re all pulling power at the exact same moment. So, on a product or group of products in the home with a power factor of less than 1, say 0.7, power is being drawn only at the peak of the incoming AC sinewave. When enough users are doing that at the same time it pulls down the AC sine wave’s peak and flattens out the wave, providing less peak power.
Power Plants fix this. Then, there’s MultiWave which extends that same peak charging area by adding a b it of 3d harmonic to extend the peak. It’s all pretty simple and legit. It’s one of the reasons we give users a scope and THD analyzer on the PP’s front panel.
1 Like
I have no problem with most of their products. Well made. The amps, DACs, preamps are all excellent products. Expensive but that’s the cost of niche manufacturing in the USA. Even the Power Plants are very well engineered and built products and like I said before, they do serve a valuable function in localities with bad AC power.
Which is something myself and plenty of others obviously not here, must question that with a product offereing like PS Audio has, why do they need to go down the road of Noise Harvesters and power cords. IMO, they would be much more respected if they just said something like this:
“We provide a power cord that our engineers have determined allows the product to operate at it’s peak performance. We understand many audiophiles like to use third party power cords. We approve this practice provided the replacement cord is of the same wire gauge or lower (meaning thicker wire) and is listed by a recognized safety authority in your jurisdiction. Also be cognizant of mechanical issues where some power cords are of immense size in comparison to the product weight.”
There! PS Audio sells their excellent and finely crafted products without turning off any potential customers.
Did we suddenly switch from Power Plants to Power Cords?
Is this some sort of obfuscation?
1 Like
The responsible thing for Amir to do as you say is to issue a revised review and an apology for measuring the wrong output. But, I suspect that’s never going to happen because he’s more interested in views than accuracy.
4 Likes
@weedeewop - I am going to need more popcorn.
3 Likes
Amir is lucky to have such a devoted fan. Nothing wrong with that. I hope he appreciates you!
1 Like
Ok Paul,
I have not done this in a few years but I will connect a scope to my AC line tonight and see what I get. (Yes I know how to do that safely by ground lifting the scope.) My house is off a single phase pad transformer fed from a 16kv three phase buried feeder. That serves at least 15 homes. I have solar too but I’ll turn it off. I know, it’s winter and not much of an HVAC load but lets just see,.
I don’t know what you mean by our houses are synchronized? Of course they are since they are all connected to the same power source?
Could not agree more and that’s all I am saying. Magazines have been issuing retractions for years. In the Online world its even easier and instant. Stops the spread of the wrong news. I am sure he has heard of this pretty heated thread.
No it’s just another example of going down the audiophile accessory road when you really don’t have to. If you have a solid equipment line, why go there and risk turning off any potential customers.
Sell the power plants for what they do. Clean up bad AC power. Nobody including Amir disputes that. But unless your AC power is rather poor I don’t see how these devices can further improve any audio system. If you think it looks cool and you like to see your AC sine wave on the cute little display, well that’s another matter all together but still your choice.
What I have a problem with on these high end forums is product owners telling people they must have this or that expensive accessory or they can’t have a good system. To give some of you a taste of your own medicine, unless you HEAR their system you have no idea how good or bad it is!
Pretty lukewarm, more like.
I think @glimmie was trying to suggest power cables are Audiofool products and PS Audio is damaging its reputation by selling them. PSA have sold them for more year than I can remember without going bust.
I think the idea is to start a new line of argument to keep things going as he spends all night in the cupboard under the stairs looking at an oscilloscope.
1 Like
Ah yes, because everyone who has a different view than yours must live in a cupboard under the stairs…
Projections like this are why these threads are so fun to read.
I was hoping this question regarding the HC output being regenerated or not could be answered? I’ve seen @jamesh mention on other threads that the HC outlet is the same as the other outlets except for allowing a higher current draw on startup to avoid triggering any PP protections.
Was this for the PP12, or a different PP?
Since the voltage of the zone D/HC outlet is variable, and is the same as the other other outlets (checked with multimeter), surely it’s regenerated?
Asking as a PP12 owner that genuinely wants to know.
3 Likes
It’s interesting to read the comments concerning the ASR review(s) and PSA PP products.
This particular kaiju fight speaks to a larger Dr. Zaius issue pervading this PSA discussion and many other “audiophile forums”. ASR tested the reviewed device with reference quality measurement instruments to inquire if it met the manufacturers specifications, which in their evaluation did not. Would anyone consider purchasing a product which on a test bench did not meet the manufacturers specifications? Many have said trust your ears and I agree with that but I also value my wallet, $5500 would allow someone to purchase a lot of music and enable those artists to make more which is why anyone should have an audio system in the first place. Some seem to value their “experienced and discriminating” hearing at the expense of others when perhaps they should consider a “check up from the neck up”. Discussions like these are killing the hobby they claim to love. The “yewts” they claim to court into said hobby are not fooled by the tribalism and for the most part see it for what it is. My advice to them has always been; spend your money on music first in whatever format suits your requirements, audio equipment is transitory… at best. Music and artists should always comes first, purchase equipment one can afford and be happy with it. The next best equipment candidates should be less expensive and provide superior performance from practical, scientific engineering manufacturers, anything else is a “third rail” pursuit. Caveat Emptor.
Perhaps this particular reference will help; Web 'Zine Page 1 The laws of physics have not changed since the publication of that article. The audiophile industry is for the most part also unchanged… @glimmie, I salute you for tilting at windmills.
I like the sound of windmills. Vitue signaling trollers are a tad sad.
1 Like
I was always under the impression they were filtered, not regenerated. I used mine for a 300B-XLS valve amp.
Nothing in the manual about HC not being regenerated. Given non-USA versions of the PP12 only have 4 outlets instead of 8, I expected all 4 to be regenerated.
1 Like
I will let you know when I need advice before my next needless purchase. I am certain that your opinions will be inexhaustible.
Thanks
1 Like