Belden ICONOCLAST Interconnects and Speaker Cabling

BJC Article (Written by Kurt D., on January 6, 2020) HDMI 2.1 and Cables.

I watched with interest over the last couple of years waiting to know what was going to be the next step in the HDMI transition into the future. After all, it never was a good solution and really created to try to insure copy write protection. All of those little tiny conductors, connectors that were difficult to pull through conduit and almost “ALL” produced in factories in my favorite…“China.”

Here is the latest that we have learned. Kurt is in Vegas at CES with multiple goals. Take a look when you have a few minutes to read. I hope this is not old information. Kurt usually is on top of the latest…

http://www.bluejeanscable.com/articles/hdmi-2-1-cables-scam.htm

Bob

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A good read, thanks for posting:)

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Bob,

Will there be a European ‘Schuko’ version of the mains cable?

Welcome to the forum. We would certainly look into a Schuko connector for our upcoming power cables if there was interest. We haven’t completed the design specifications just yet focusing first on a BJC/BAV product and later a full Iconoclast design. Thank you for your interest and stay tuned.

Thank you Bob,

Been a long time lurker, totally bowled over with the OFE 4x4 interconnects I received just before Xmas, so definitely interested in iconoclast power leads!

Jeff

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Don’t you guys just feel sorry for folks who haven’t had the chance to get their hands on Iconoclast products? I mean, really. We’ve been knocking around on this thread for years now and there’s been some traction but one day these will just explode. Boom. Game over for the other cable companies. It’ll be awful hard to sell a $20k interconnect then. :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:

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Thank you very much sir and I could not agree more. We will go “Boom” and I feel it coming! In a good way of course! And, I really do feel sorry for those who have not had the opportunity to hear what a “real” cable sounds like.

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I just replaced Shunyata Venom RCA IC’s going from preamp to amp with Iconoclast OCC off @BobBJC’s demo" discounted list…
The Shunyata’s are relatively inexpensive but have OCC conductors. They sound great.
But the amount of nuance information that the Iconoclast reveal make them worth the cash.
Each instrument and voice appear to be more complete. Very nice.

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Ron,

Interconnect leads, or our hearing, take your pick are definitely a harder cable to understand. The input impedance load of an RCA or XLR is extremely high. And, this drops the amount of current in the actual signal wires. E=IR and we know E is 1 Volt or so and the input impedance is, in theory, infinity so I has to be very low. This is why we can use such skinny wires in RCA and XLR cable for the SIGNAL, not the ground, lead. Speaker leads have a near dead short, for all practical purposes, on the cable end. E=IR where R is very low (the speaker) and E is a higher voltage (0-50 volts is typical) at the speaker terminal. The speaker cable current has to be far higher as “R” is so low to produce the voltage. In one case we have lots of electron’s moving and the other far fewer. More voltage allows more current delivery into a set load.

The interesting issue is using the “single wire” technology verses the “quad” wire technology in the RCA and XLR where the wire size is far small in the quad design (10-mil verses 20-mil). Yes, the smaller wire lowers the cables impedance across the frequency range, and is measurable. But, it is far, far less so than a speaker cable as we already have pretty small wires in even the single wire design. The generation II was “supposed to” prove that the 20-mil wire was more than small enough. It didn’t show that to be the case so we now have a crazier design to manufacture but it is better sounding. By all right of measurement it should not be…but it is. The TPC 4x4 and 1x4 sound as good as the UPOCC 1x4 and 1x1 design on analog sources, or so close I can’t separate them. This is a great deal for you, the TPC 1x4 and 4x4 is cheaper to buy and, the differences on up the wire metallurgy price scale are finer between each grade.

The calculations and data support true"improvement" in the cable but the “numbers” don’t suggest we can hear the changes. Use them to decide which is true in your system.

Best,
Galen Gareis

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Any updates to share on the power cord venture? Just curious :slight_smile:

The BAV series of 10, 12 and 14 AWG power cords are going to be UTP and test very well for dielectric performance in the audio band, and passively attenuate RF with a high absorption and loss tangent values verified with testing against even my $$$ reference cord. The tests show superior passive dielectric noise rejection. These will be nice, affordable cords. We’ll have the data that drove the decisions…and WHY we won’t make cords when we already have a great set of cable. This was an unexpected test regimen. I use the BAV series in my system right now…all of the power cords are what we will offer.

We expect to be able to show them at AXPONA if we get the approved parts BOM in house in time. We will have a booth in the floor area.

The ICONOCLAST power cords won’t be for awhile as it they are “new” cords and will be far more complex (added shields and magnetic EM wave cancellation tech). I can’t make promises on that as we don’t do promises, we go by the test data on real stuff.

Best,
Galen Gareis

Your BAV cords just individual conductors of 10 , 12, and 14? What about insulation dielectric and weave. Any multiple conductors or iconoclastic twist weaves?(

I look forward to your 2020 Axpona cable and power cord display.

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Our BAV cords are EPDM thermoset dielectric and jacket design. Most applications don’t need $$$ shields and lower inductance as modern power supplies are pretty darn good. The BAV series has very competitive L and C as well as passive RF absorption where it is needed, better than $$$ cords sets used as reference.

The data will be available to everyone and what we did and why. I use all the cords in my system.

Only the ICONOCLAST cordsets will use multiple weave wires to cancel EM waves to lower inductance and use 100 a dB shield. The dielectric will remain the same to superimpose natural RF dissipation to the field cancellaton properties.

Don’t hold your breath on ICONOCLAST power cords. There are performance IDEALS, and then there are UL safety REQUIREMENTS that can limit the extent a design meets best case electrical and that may NOT be an adequate design for safety. You get one, and see if the second one is still intact.

I am currently breaking in a new and just repaired ARC pre and as soon as it breaks in, some of the last upgrades I need to do is from pre to mono amps. I have been following this thread with great interest as I got a little birdie from Pass, when I inquired about speaker cables that mated well with their equipment and the ARC 5se I was advised to research the Iconoclast speaker cables.

With that out of the way, I have a somewhat unusual issue and I am looking for suggestions around the problem. My current and for foreseeable future I currently run Shahinian Acoustics Hawks. These speakers have two distinct components, a sub base and an assembly of the mid/hi speakers. In order to bi-wire, there would need to have 3’ of bare leads to get into the top assembly as posts are under the assembly. The sub base also have connections in bottom of the cabinet.

Galen,

Thanks for info. I look forward to the eventual roll outs.

Good Morning Steve, thanks for sharing the info on the tip from Pass. I will have to send them a thank you note. We are indeed the best choice in any truly high performance system. Give us a try when the time comes and you will be totally amazed at the improvements in sound quality.

Bob

Bob,

My pleasure. When the time come (which should be shortly), I am thinking of either two pairs of 5 footers, unless you can make a pair of bi-wired pair with 24” or so of exposed leads to the speakers so I can connect to both terminals. At some point I will measure exactly what would be required to get to both sets of terminals.

SteveA

Steve,

For ANY cable to work right, the DISTANCE between the cable conductors has to be controlled or…you really don’t get the specs you are paying for.

Capacitance is distance and dielectric determined, and inductane is distance and magnetic field determined.

You want to keep the ENDS of the cable as close as you can. The REASON ICONOCLAST is so tightly bound, and works so well is I make sure the two polarity are as CLOSE as I can get…and keep them there as much as possible.

OK, what we need is maybe some pictures to see if we can make jumpers of some sort without such a LONG distance of uncontrolled polarity separation.

Yes, SOME separation is a requirement to use the cables and this is why we test them as an ASSEMBLY as we make them for you, not the BULK cable with no polarity separation(s). That’s cheating as you’ll NEVER be able to use it like that.

Laying of the hands won’t ever get past the physics. Cognative effort is required to make sure we sell you a workable solution and not just take your money. I educate you so you KNOW if we are indeed doing that.

I like to keep the polarity “legs” six inches or so long if we can. Many pieces of equipment set the terminals too far apart, negatively impacting the cable electricals. What happens INSIDE is important, too, as it is part of the cable chain.

Best,
Galen Gareis

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I pretty much assumed as much which is why when I started looking at the speaker cables, I determined one of the best alternative would be using one pair for the woofer sections, and one pair for the assembly. The only other possibility would to go into subs and jump to top assembly with a 30” cable from the subs to top assembly. Terminals are on the bottom of both pieces

SteveA

Image result for shahinian acoustics hawk assemble