So might @paul172
Hi Galen
what is the story on dedicated wires for use within a speaker. Are you planning to offer some iconoclast “hookup” wire?
The article mentioned the possibility of this happening.
We will have a internal speaker cable polarity later on. It will likely ONLY BE one copper science due to cost of carrying so many differing types. Two coppers MAY be offered to OEM’s. The internal wire is an OEM market at the moment and we have worked with a few already to evaluate enhanced performance.
So far so good on the performance. We have a lot on our plate right now so progress is deliberately slow to insure quality and proper electricals.
Best,
Galen
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Given the delay do you have a recommendation for a currently available wire that is good for internal speaker wiring?
thanks
There are two problems inside speakers, HOW it is installed and WHAT is installed. I know from ICONOCLAST that the HOW is more important than the WHAT if the wire is of even reasonable quality. But, we buy the name of the WHAT (super earth material wire) and have no clue on the HOW it is used or designed.
The polarity need to be tightly bound to control the cable electrical L and C as well as Vp properties through audio. Most internal wire is not designed right, and could be better. This means every speaker of the same design is a different electrical load if wire isn’t installed properly. A transmission line or L and C controlled cable is physicals equals electrical.
Look at your speakers and make sure the wire is geometrically stable along the lengths as much as possible. That’s job one. If not, that needs to be solved. Get each polarity uniformly close to each other.
Second is what the wire design actually is. Here is where it gets complicated to make improvements. The wire’s EM field properties can alter Vp linearity and put a proper AWG size to each driver. We don’t need 10 AWG stranded single strand wire to a mid or tweeter for example. What would go to a woofer isn’t appropriate for a tweeter if fully optimized.
We’ll look at both what and how as well as optimization that can help fidelity based on the proper measure and calculation. Will it make a difference on the product and off the paper? Speaker designers will say no, it can’t be heard even if it is better. OK, but we have a couple of OEM studies that report that’s not the case on better speakers. I did not hear the comparison. Our users seem to feel ICONOCLAST external products sure help but OEM internal speaker wire is a different application so we’ll have to see. We don’t want to jerk your chain if improvements are excessively expensive for what it may or may not do.
Best,
Galen Gareis
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I just went back and re-read my old review of the first generation Iconoclast speaker cables from 6 yrs ago. I kind of started out with a wince, wondering what I would regret about what I wrote but I don’t have any reservations about any of it. It is great to see other, more experienced reviewers have a glowing impression of the Iconoclast line. The cables were so good that I thought maybe I was suffering from any variety of biases at the time. I was pretty anxious about being a “real” imposter, if that makes any sense. I’ve read every post to this thread over the years and it’s been great to see how well Iconoclast, and Galen, have been received and respected. We’ve gotten to witness the ongoing paradigm shift in the audio industry develop right before our eyes. It still has a long way to go but people are starting to catch on. Thanks particularly to Paul for being so supportive and featuring Galen’s writing in Copper and allowing this thread to blossom on the Forum.
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So, you’re back to lamp cord?! I’m kidding.
I’ve had the TPC and now SPTPC for more than 3 years all together. Great stuff.
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I’ve used this for internal hookup wire to good effect.
Coat hangers strung together!
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The data sheet is correct, it is a WIRE, not a cable. To optimize electrical we need to make a cable FROM a wire of proper geometry. It is the same issue inside the speaker as outside.
I’ll explain what I did to everyone when I do it and the data will really explain it for me.
Best,
Galen
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At least those last few inches are much shorter than the 7’ speaker cable in my case.
Will your CABLE be flexible enough to install in a small stand mount speaker with not much volume? How will they terminate?
This is why it will be OEM, the consumer internal wire market can’t negotiate termination variation complexity. OEM can properly prep the cable terminations for X-over and drivers. EVERY application is different.
The internal design can improve flex as external abuse won’t be an issue.
Best,
Galen
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I’ve found soldering is better than push-on clips. I’m definitely interested as I have very high resolution speakers.
You might look at searching Belden 1309A (14AWG) or Belden 1308A (16AWG) OFHC copper. These are both smaller AWG variants of our BAV 1313A speaker cables (10AWG.) Both would make very good choices for most internal applications. You might call Jeff at BJC to check on availability. The issue will probably be finding someone to offer you cut lengths. https://catalog.belden.com/techdata/EN/1309A_techdata.pdf
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Thank you very much for you and a few others for being instrumental in getting this whole thread and relationship at PSAudio started. It has surely grown!!! Grateful sir!
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The link below the listing made me laugh!
https://echohifi.com/details/16027/Iconoclast_Iconoclast-TPC-4X4
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I decided to give a go to bi-wiring, taking advantage of the dual binding posts in my amp. So I bought 4 runs of BJC 10AWG speaker cables (5T00UP).
I wonder if someone could give me advice if I should run these cables together in paralell, twisted or if I should keep them apart.
I would keep them separate. The concept of bi-wire is allowing each signal path to operate on its own without the others influence, as much as practical. Bi-amp would be the next logical step.
Thanks for replying. But keeping them separate would not mess with the inductance/capacitance of the “cable network”?
On the contrary, not keeping them apart will allow them to interact. A few inches is probably sufficient but Galen is much more knowledgeable than I am.
Try it both ways and listen for a difference…isn’t that the ultimate goal?