Did a UPOCC VS. Second generation TPC 1x4 comparison today. My initial impression was how similar the cables sound. Both are 24 feet in length, I do not think the average person would hear the difference. The UPOCC has a somewhat softer presentation, with less detail, focus, mid bass clarity and punch than the Second Generation TPC 1x4. My short hand: The UPOCC sounds like a really great Tube Amp, the TPC 1x4 sounds like a really great class A Solid State Amp.
Second listening comparison: I had also been using the original first Generation TPC speaker and RCA cable in a secondary system. Which consists of Odyssey monoblock amps, first generation TPC RCA and speaker cable, and Spatial speakers. I swapped out the TPC RCA for the UPOCC RCA’s, the noise floor dropped, the soundstage became more three dimensional, vocals were warmer and more natural in tone, the bass was deeper and punchier. The whole system was magical, less fatiguing and I could not stop listening.
I was surprised and did not think the $1600 Spatial speakers would be revealing enough to demonstrate RCA cable differences, but they were. With the TPC 1x4’s I have gotten more conscious of the grain, hash, smearing, and poor timing which can be heard with lesser cables. Next time I will try out the Second Generation TPC 1x4 on the Odysseys.
On another subject, I if all goes as planned in 3 weeks I will be adding 2 pairs / 4 panels of mint condition KLH Nines to my speaker collection. Wglenn you will have to come over and check them out.
Minor nit: the “second generation” XLR/RCA is actually a 4 x 4, not a 1 x 4. To reduce inductance, each conductor of the “first generation” 1 x 4 was split into 4 smaller (30 gauge) wires in a star quad configuration, hence the “4 x 4” nomenclature in the “second generation.”
Yes, so that’s 12 wires for the XLRs. The small wire helps mitigate the amount of skin effect group delay since there is more consistency in propagation velocities. To keep the resistance reasonable, multiple wires were necessary. The star quad arose because he chose to use 4 wires. 30ga wire is just stupid fine.
Will, it’s not just the propagation delay from skin effect, but the close proximity of the 4 wires in the star quad reduces total inductance of the wire the same way it does on the speaker cable, namely, the 4 fields from each wire cancels its neighbor’s field. This leaves the much weaker overall fields outside the star quad as the only remaining inductance, and then those are cancelled against each other with the other three remaining star-quads in the bundle.
It does raise total capacitance a bit, but seeing as how impedance is linear with inductance and inversely proportional with capacitance (wrt frequency) the lower inductance trumps the slightly higher capacitance.
I’ll work with Hanson, as I demo’ed the V1 a couple of years ago thru them. I returned them because I was concerned about trying to straighten the tightly-coiled wires which did not seem to want to be uncoiled straight.
I have a 25 foot run. The cable has a natural preferred way it wants to be bent or coiled. Don’t fight it, or you risk pinching or kinking the cable and defeating the design and operation. The standard 1.5 meter length should work fine in most systems.
If you look way back in this thread, you’d find that I demo’ed the cables a couple of years ago, and sent them back because they were tightly coiled.
I didn’t want to damage them by trying to straighten them out, but Galen tells me that gently encouraging them straight with a book or other light weight on them will let them take a new set, so I’ll give it another shot because they sounded really good.
I’ve ordered 5.5M ETPC, and requested that Belden ship in a large flat-pack box, to reduce their tendency to take a set while tightly coiled.
Galen tells me he will terminate them himself - maybe I can get him to sign them…
6^)
Actually, for the performance, they are a bargain compared to many ICs with stupid-high five-figure price-tags, like the Nordost Odin:
“The retail price is $19,999.99 for a 0.6 meter pair; additional half stereo meter increments are $2,499.99.”
Well I think he does test them all personally and provides the test report. (Perhaps they now have someone else doing the tests, but they are still provided with each cable AFAIK.) I don’t think any other cable manufacturer does that. For the people that like numbers I’d think that would be an advantage and they show that the cables are hard to beat objectively.
I had the 1st generation cables in and felt particularly the speaker cables were excellent. (And subjectively sounded louder than the pure copper cables I currently use). The only issue that stopped me from ordering was the 10 foot minimum length. I use short runs to my mono block bhk 300’s. But I am quad wiring - and the added cable and expense was prohibitive. I thought about buying two 10 foot runs and cutting them in half and having terminated but felt that would compromise the cable.
As Ted said - Galen mentioned the signature on the test report.
Aside from a complete lack of marketing and a dead web page, I’ve wondered why there are zero reviews of the Iconoclast products elsewhere on the web.
BTW, if the hi-fi stores aren’t being responsive enough, contact Bob Howard, National Sales Manager at Belden. You’ll get a prompt accurate response from him, and he can direct-ship the cables from the factory. Bob.Howard@belden.com
I tried to contact Hanson Audio, since they sent me the eval cables a couple of years ago, but got no response to an inquiry from their web site.