Haven’t gotten to SACD yet, but red book went this way for me. PWT was more polite, DMP had a little more sizzle. Then I changed from a PSAUDIO AC10 HDMI to the supplied short cable for the DMP. WOW. Rearrange if you have to, but at least try the shorty.
BTW: I tend to concentrate on vocal sound. Seems harder to get right, perhaps due to Eq or other enhancement they put on it. Or, as I well know, the very microphone they used (freq response be damned). there is quite a variation model to model and sometimes even within different mics of the same model.). The there’s how hot the CD is… often flirting with or just soul kissing clipping. I wonder if SACDs are mastered with less of that nasty evil?
For some reason, every single improvement I’ve made in my system over the digital years has resulted it better tighter bass, among other things.
With a new drive in my PWT (a result of a known glitch that caused the disc to randomly stop playing - my PWT unit arrived back from Colorado earlier this week) I was able to do an A to B comparison of the two players using a single disc - Shelby Lynne’s “Dusty” CD of which I have 2 copies, the US version on Lost Highway with 10 tracks and the UK version with 11 tracks - the extra track being “Wishin’ and Hopin” - with one caveat - the PWT was connected to the DSD with a well used (3 years PSA AC12-3 cable) and the DMP with a brand new 1m Morrow HDMI.
With the DMP and the Morrow, the sound stage is still wider than the PWT - more “air”, more separation of the instruments - but the PWT also sounds pretty good on a scale of 1 to 10 about an 7.5 compared with the DMP. I found the same effect when I reversed the discs in the units. First test DMP US disc, PWT - UK disc; second DMP UK disc, PWT US disc. I’ll have to continue breaking the Morrow in see if the separation in sound between the two units increases as Paul and others have noted a major effect of the cable type on the sound.
One thing I’d like to add re the DMP is playing SACDs. I have a few in my collection including a boxed Bob Dylan set on Columbia that I bought on sale from Pop Market several years ago. I’d listened to the Dylan set on my Marantz SA 8005 SACD player which can switch back and forth between the Redbook and SACD layers while playing and was frankly non plussed. I put the SACD in the same bag of CD maker hype as HDCD, SHM, gold discs, 24 bit remastered, green markers, etc. But playing the Dylan SACDs on the DMP was a revelation - it was in fact jaw dropping - with the Redbook play mode there was a lot missing from the sound - whether different mixes were used for the two layers I don’t know but remember that I personally heard no difference between the CD and SACD layers of the Dylan discs on my Marantz.
I found the same with with Boulez’s Bolero SACD (DG 00289 477 0762). The nearest thing to the Bolero live is listening via headphones but the DMP SACD mode opened the sound up on the speakers. I’ve never heard the Bolero this good in the 55 years I’ve been listening to it on both vinyl and CD.
I’m current listening to the SACD hybrid of John Tropea’s “Rock Candy” (I don’t think there ever was a CD) on the DMP and even with the Morrow HDMI cable still breaking in the drums sound so realistic - an “oomph” that just isn’t there listening to the CD layer and a very smooth and complex bass line - dark, deep and full but still musical. It sounds so real!!!
The DMP has added a new dimension to my listening pleasure!
woodburger said
I tend to concentrate on vocal sound. Seems harder to get right, perhaps due to Eq or other enhancement they put on it. Or, as I well know, the very microphone they used (freq response be damned). there is quite a variation model to model and sometimes even within different mics of the same model.).
Singers and recording engineers work very hard to get the specific vocal sound they seek - especially in pop/rock/ - trying different mics, proximity, EQ, compression, etc. Whether they got it "right" depends entirely what sound you prefer. This makes using vocal as a sound test tough as one is chasing a rapidly moving target, unless you are exceedingly familiar with a particular recording and how it should sound. The sound of a pop singer is astoundingly different without a mic v. recorded.
A great example is watching Alison Krauss perform live. She sings close mic’d into a Shure KSM44A large diaphragm mic which is vocal flattering, but plays her violin into a Neumann KM54 small‑diaphragm condenser (studio) or on-stage often a Shure KSM9, with a much flatter frequency response. Reversed, her voice would sound less brilliant and less warm, and the violin would sound brittle and a bit boomy. (In the studio she uses a $10,000 Sony C800G Tube Condenser on her voice.)
The there's how hot the CD is... often flirting with or just soul kissing clipping. I wonder if SACDs are mastered with less of that nasty evil?
Typically they are exactly the same on a modern SACD/CD/Redbook layer. The recording is mixed, mastered and then transcoded as needed to the chosen format. There are older SACs where the layers are fundamentally different, but this is relatively uncommon.
The best way to avoid the sound of compression and limiting is to listen to classical recordings which eschew this type of sound.
I have had and been listening to the DMP since Thursday, in my two systems. The listening experience with both red book cds and SACD is having several veils removed, or similar looking through a window after it has been perfectly cleaned. Instruments, including voice, are simply more resolved than before. Paul has said that for the first time the listener can now hear the music on SACD as never before, given that we can now access the DSD layer. I am listening to one now: just unbelievable how much closer this is to what I would hear in the concert hall.
In my second system, where I am now listening I have a Classe AV processor, which is used for both two channel and multi channel music listening as well as for video. The Classe has a pretty good DAC. However, a few minutes ago I connected the DMP via coax to the DAC on the Classe and was able to A/B the Classe DAC and the Direct Stream DAC - no contest, smearing that I might not have paid attention to listening only through the Classe became objectionable when one heard the same disc via the two PS Audio units. The DMP appears to deliver all that Paul promised. Koodos!
Hi everyone. I’m new to this forum and since I have a PWT, I thought I would compare it with the new DMP.
When I received the DMP, I did something I normally don’t do, I hooked it up and played it cold right out of the box. I set the DMP on top of the PWT and used the same wires on both units. I have a 1/2 meter HDMI cable already that I used on both units for I2S into my DAC. I actually reversed the two transports, PWT on top of the DMP to see if it made any difference, It did not. My A/B comparison was as close to equal as I am able to do.
I currently only play red book CD’s but will get into SACD’s later. I don’t have a turntable, so no comparison there.
The first thing I noticed was how wide the sound stage was, way beyond the outside of the speakers. The next thing I noticed was the snappy attack on individual notes played in the music. The lower bass notes were not as defined as I remembered on the PWT so I decided to play a break in CD for a few hours to see what would change. Remember, the DMP is cold out of the box.
One of the problems I’ve had with CD’s over the years has been a slightly irritating edge in the mid range of any speaker I have owned. If the song I played didn’t have much of this certain frequency, it was was much more pleasing to listen to. Once I keyed onto this distortion?, I couldn’t get away from it. I am pleased to say, The DMP does not have this irritating edge!!!..THANK YOU PAUL!!!
After letting the DMP warm up and break in for about a day and a half, I did some listening. The first thing noticed was the bass was defined again…YES! Each instrument is clear and well defined and in a space of its own. The instruments and voices jump out of a clear and ambient stage with a sense of the venue or room they were recorded in. I listened to a Tony Braxton CD where she is singing out in front of a row of stringed instruments that seemed placed along the entire width of my listening room, her voice was clear and sweet in the middle. It is interesting that it seems I can play songs at a lower volume and get full dynamics including bass. In contrast, the PWT seams smeared and congested. I don’t want to seem down on the PWT as I’ve enjoyed it very much over the past few years but the DMP is a huge improvement.
I know we have been talking about the importance of source compared to speakers but I’ll say after doing this comparison in sources, I’d be hard pressed to talk about speakers. There are extremely expensive transports and DAC’s that I have no experience with but I doubt they are much better than the DMP.
kline42 said
Hi everyone. I'm new to this forum and since I have a PWT, I thought I would compare it with the new DMP.
When I received the DMP, I did something I normally don’t do, I hooked it up and played it cold right out of the box. I set the DMP on top of the PWT and used the same wires on both units. I have a 1/2 meter HDMI cable already that I used on both units for I2S into my DAC. I actually reversed the two transports, PWT on top of the DMP to see if it made any difference, It did not. My A/B comparison was as close to equal as I am able to do.
I currently only play red book CD’s but will get into SACD’s later. I don’t have a turntable, so no comparison there.
The first thing I noticed was how wide the sound stage was, way beyond the outside of the speakers. The next thing I noticed was the snappy attack on individual notes played in the music. The lower bass notes were not as defined as I remembered on the PWT so I decided to play a break in CD for a few hours to see what would change. Remember, the DMP is cold out of the box.
One of the problems I’ve had with CD’s over the years has been a slightly irritating edge in the mid range of any speaker I have owned. If the song I played didn’t have much of this certain frequency, it was was much more pleasing to listen to. Once I keyed onto this distortion?, I couldn’t get away from it. I am pleased to say, The DMP does not have this irritating edge!!!..THANK YOU PAUL!!!
After letting the DMP warm up and break in for about a day and a half, I did some listening. The first thing noticed was the bass was defined again…YES! Each instrument is clear and well defined and in a space of its own. The instruments and voices jump out of a clear and ambient stage with a sense of the venue or room they were recorded in. I listened to a Tony Braxton CD where she is singing out in front of a row of stringed instruments that seemed placed along the entire width of my listening room, her voice was clear and sweet in the middle. It is interesting that it seems I can play songs at a lower volume and get full dynamics including bass. In contrast, the PWT seams smeared and congested. I don’t want to seem down on the PWT as I’ve enjoyed it very much over the past few years but the DMP is a huge improvement.
I know we have been talking about the importance of source compared to speakers but I’ll say after doing this comparison in sources, I’d be hard pressed to talk about speakers. There are extremely expensive transports and DAC’s that I have no experience with but I doubt they are much better than the DMP.
I hope this review Helps, Roger
thanks Roger. that is where i am in that i have a PWT and a DMP on order. no turntable either. so your post was really helpful. i am looking forward to doing the same thing you are doing. i found the PWT/DSD to be so much better than anything i had owned up to that point (with the caveat that i could no longer hear my pure SACD discs, or the SACD layer), so adding the DMP should be great.
Paul McGowan said
It's crazy how good that little short HDMI cable sounds. I am always fascinated by such things, but this one really surprised me.
Can't agree with you more. Just started listening to it today changing 6 ft carbon from audio quest. This small one is fabulous. Is it because of the shorter length ?
Paul McGowan said
It's crazy how good that little short HDMI cable sounds. I am always fascinated by such things, but this one really surprised me.
Can’t agree with you more. Just started listening to it today changing 6 ft carbon from audio quest. This small one is fabulous. Is it because of the shorter length ?
Regards,
Sourav
I am assuming it is 0.5m long, so it seems to me that the length is playing some part. Really need someone to find a 1m cable that performs at least as good, if not better, for all those who cannot get the units close enough.
I have both the .5 m and 1 m lengths of the PS Audio AC-12 HDMI cables and really don’t think the length makes a difference. . . . I hear very noticeable differences between different makes and models of HDMI cables though. Would love a 1 m length of the cable supplied with the PMD.
rvann@nxs.net said
The DMP is great. detail is better than the old player, just seems to be so right. NOW sacd is fantastic. Puts my old Wadia to shame. more to come.
kline42 said
Hi everyone. I'm new to this forum and since I have a PWT, I thought I would compare it with the new DMP.
When I received the DMP, I did something I normally don’t do, I hooked it up and played it cold right out of the box. I set the DMP on top of the PWT and used the same wires on both units. I have a 1/2 meter HDMI cable already that I used on both units for I2S into my DAC. I actually reversed the two transports, PWT on top of the DMP to see if it made any difference, It did not. My A/B comparison was as close to equal as I am able to do.
I currently only play red book CD’s but will get into SACD’s later. I don’t have a turntable, so no comparison there.
The first thing I noticed was how wide the sound stage was, way beyond the outside of the speakers. The next thing I noticed was the snappy attack on individual notes played in the music. The lower bass notes were not as defined as I remembered on the PWT so I decided to play a break in CD for a few hours to see what would change. Remember, the DMP is cold out of the box.
One of the problems I’ve had with CD’s over the years has been a slightly irritating edge in the mid range of any speaker I have owned. If the song I played didn’t have much of this certain frequency, it was was much more pleasing to listen to. Once I keyed onto this distortion?, I couldn’t get away from it. I am pleased to say, The DMP does not have this irritating edge!!!..THANK YOU PAUL!!!
After letting the DMP warm up and break in for about a day and a half, I did some listening. The first thing noticed was the bass was defined again…YES! Each instrument is clear and well defined and in a space of its own. The instruments and voices jump out of a clear and ambient stage with a sense of the venue or room they were recorded in. I listened to a Tony Braxton CD where she is singing out in front of a row of stringed instruments that seemed placed along the entire width of my listening room, her voice was clear and sweet in the middle. It is interesting that it seems I can play songs at a lower volume and get full dynamics including bass. In contrast, the PWT seams smeared and congested. I don’t want to seem down on the PWT as I’ve enjoyed it very much over the past few years but the DMP is a huge improvement.
I know we have been talking about the importance of source compared to speakers but I’ll say after doing this comparison in sources, I’d be hard pressed to talk about speakers. There are extremely expensive transports and DAC’s that I have no experience with but I doubt they are much better than the DMP.
Paul McGowan said
It's crazy how good that little short HDMI cable sounds. I am always fascinated by such things, but this one really surprised me.
Can’t agree with you more. Just started listening to it today changing 6 ft carbon from audio quest. This small one is fabulous. Is it because of the shorter length ?
Regards,
Sourav
That’s the $64,000 question - and we have a longer version being made now. Will let you know. None were more surprised than I at how good this cable sounds. We designed it and had it made as a decent starter cable that people could upgrade when they wanted. So far, no aftermarket cable has come even close. Go figure!
badbeef said
Paul, have you sorted out what the "stock" HDMI cable is to be? Earlier on you were saying you would be shipping us a better cable. ETA on that?
The beta units all should have shipped with the short "stock" HDMI cable we're all so excited about. Did you not get one?
