Is Roon support going to be EOL?


#1

I read in another forum that Roon support on your products will be replaced by a PS Audio streaming service/app. Is this true? In the other post it states you are looking to compete with Roon. Is there any truth to this? confused

Sorry if this is in another post somewhere. I tried to search but didn’t find it.


#2

Bridge II should continue to support Roon. The new server family of products (including Bridge III, a ripper/server and other products), known as Octave, will not.


#3

Hmm I guess I didn’t do enough research before purchasing my DS Jr. Roon support was one of the major reasons for purchasing it. My fear is future Roon development, etc. on the DS Jr. will be limited at best.


#4

It seems really unfortunate that a device that accepts ethernet and plays Roon presently will be restricted on its future uses. I guess I will not bother upgrading the hardware or software in this case. Octave would have a pretty high bar to beat if their objective is to beat Roon. It’s the only software competing with JRiver and Logitech Media Server that just works, every time, which is only exacerbated by the fact those software programs have been around for a considerable amount of time.

Should be interesting in the coming year(s) but if Bridge III means no Roon at all, I’m out. At least make it possible for both input types. Asking for HQ Player NAA compatibility is likely a pipe-dream too :wink:


#5

This is pretty shocking news. I’m really a little taken aback at the rather casual and offhand way stevem2 let this cat out of the bag here. If this is true, I think PS Audio has some explaining to do. Paul McGowan: Is this true and if so, what is going on here?


#6

Yes - shocking! I agree with all above me. Roon compatibility was a big sell for the DS DACs (Bridge II). If support is being totally dropped, how come? Is the expectation that Roonies will drop for Octave? I don’t think of PS Audio as a software/music management company but are you thinking to compete directly with Roon - probably the best out there?

For those of us who handed over library management to Roon, I suspect it will be very difficult to go back. I am hoping i will not have to decide between a PS Audio front end and Roon!

Hoping for more clarification…


#7

As a former Sooloos owner, if I had to chose between Roon and PSA (Octave or whatever), I will go Roon. I’m a true believer that my music collection is the most important part of my system. Music management is key for me.

When the dust settles I hope PSA will provide support for Roon and their version of music management SW if this is indeed true.


#8
David Bernat said

This is pretty shocking news. I’m really a little taken aback at the rather casual and offhand way stevem2 let this cat out of the bag here. If this is true, I think PS Audio has some explaining to do. Paul McGowan: Is this true and if so, what is going on here?


The news is out on other boards already and the discussion isn’t pretty. Quite a few of us PSAers are shocked by the news. I posted the question here to see if it really was true what others are already saying.

#9

EVERYONE: I really don’t think what you’re worried about is true. PS Audio’s development of Octave does not change the DS DACs with respect to Roon. It’s a DAC, and Octave will be a server. The Bridge II (or a future B III) is made by another company, which adds to the equation. Yes, they hope to make a product that is better both functionally and sonically than Roon, but my current understanding is it won’t prevent anyone from using Roon. And I say this as a Roon user.

Elk, perhaps you can weigh in.

Also read up here - we’ve all been asking the questions for a while now, and PS is very open with their development process.

http://www.psaudio.com/forum/latest-ideas-forum/ps-audio-music-server-in-the-pipeline/page-10/#p76924


#10
David Bernat said I'm really a little taken aback at the rather casual and offhand way stevem2 let this cat out of the bag here.
Stevem2 did not let anything out which is not already public knowledge; i.e., no escaped cat.

BridgeII will continue to offer Roon and will continue to be supported/updated by PS Audio. Thus, if you purchased a Bridge expecting Roon support you have not lost anything. PS Audio’s track record of supporting legacy products is superb.

PS Audio’s new server line (Octave) will not support Roon. If Roon support is decisive for you these new products may not be of interest to you.


#11

Roon support as promised in the DSJ, DirectStream, and PWD through Bridge II isn’t going away. In fact, there will soon be an update so the new RAAT they announced (that supports MQA) will be available in another month or so.

We are big Roon fans and continue to support them and their platform. If you own a Bridge II (either built in or as an add on card) there’s no reason to panic as we will continue supporting and updating Bridge II. I think we’ve proven our commitment to supporting our products and updating them over the years as best we are able (we just recently updated the PWD and Bridges with Roon and MQA were included). So, our support shouldn’t be in question. If you bought Bridge II or DSJ because of Roon, you shouldn’t have to worry. Relax. Enjoy your music and Roon.

What’s causing the hubbub is the announcement that Bridge III, which will launch sometime in 2018, will have Octave, our own music management software, and player. I quite think Roon users will like Octave very much, but that’s not germain to this discussion. We won’t ask anyone to change preferences. That was never our intention. If you like Roon (and who doesn’t?), stay with Bridge II and we will continue its updating. There’s really no downside I can see. Bridge III isn’t going to have some new miracle technology inside that will obsolete the excellent performance of Bridge II. Bridge II is such a stellar performer that would be incredibly hard to do and that isn’t our goal.

So, in summary, Bridge II remains a product we will support and it will always have Roon. If that is what you purchased, you made a wise choice.

Octave, on the other hand, is being developed because we believe we have created an extraordinary music management system people will love (the few beta testers of this platform are already raving). We’ve been working on Octave for years—in one form or another—and now it is finally peeping its head out of the mist (it’s not like we just decided to jump into this complex challenge). Another reason for developing Octave is that as a company responsible for the quality of our customer’s music systems, the only way we can guarantee performance is to control the entire experience. Long time readers of this forum know that while I love the ease and discoverability of the Roon management software, I have never been a fan of their server’s sound quality. The only way to ensure sound quality is to control both hardware and software.

Lastly, from a 50,000 foot view, it is my responsibility as CEO of this company to make sure our customers are taken care of over the long term, something we’re proud to have been able to do over the past 45 years. Basing one of our core products on third party software, no matter how excellent, isn’t the smartest long term strategy when consistency and quality are foremost on our minds. I believe, and have always believed, that the best way to serve our customers is to provide an unparalleled user experience—one we can guarantee over the years. Octave will be a key component to that strategy.

None of this means we’re abandoning support for Roon. We will continue to support Roon and keep the Bridge II products (of which there are many thousands) up to date and current.


Popping sound related to Directstream Junior?
#12

Paul,

Thanks for the great clarification.

I use to own a Perfectwave DAC w/Bridge and then upgraded it to DirectStream. I sold the unit and purchased a Generation 1 Sooloos solution because of the music management. I personally have always felt that music management was the weakest part of your bridge functionality. Now the sound quality of your DAC was and is better than Sooloos but the ease of music management is key for me.

Again thanks for the great info and continued support of the Bridge II/Roon interaction.

One question I do have is, will Octave function with the Bridge II?


#13

I apologize if I caused confusion but I didn’t realize there was anything ambiguous about “Bridge II should continue to support Roon,” although in retrospect I should have said “will” rather than “should”. (All based on prior posts by Paul–see the thread badbeef linked. In theat thread Paul also goes into more detail on why the new server hardware will not support Roon.) For DS Jr. owners or would be owners who still might be unclear, that is the Ethernet interface that is built into the DS Jr and is also the current add-in Ethernet card for the DS senior. As Paul, Elk and badbeef said, if you like Roon and want to continue using it, just keep the hardware you’ve got and you’ll be fine. You can also use Roon over the USB input and that won’t change either.


#14

Thanks, Bryan and I couldn’t agree more. Until Roon came along music management through PS products and third party software solutions (like DLNA apps) were lame. That didn’t mean we just threw in the towel and said “best we can do”. We rolled our sleeves up and got to work. Octave will be the realization of a decade’s old dream for me, personally.

In fact, Octave will (I hope) take music management up another notch from the heights it is currently at. We’re not aiming to get close to all that’s great out there, but to represent the single best music management system in the world. That takes a lot, and the only way to do that (as the guys at Sooloos now Roon knew/know) is to control both hardware and software. Roon has done an amazing job with their software and they’ve even started making it easy to use off the shelf hardware like the NUC to run their software. That’s good stuff. But we believe off the shelf hardware is not going to cut it when sound quality is critical. That’s why we’re taking our time and tackling both.

Unfortunately, Bridge II will not be available to handle Octave for the same reason Bridge III cannot handle Roon. We’re utilizing every pocket of resources specifically for Octave. Getting an Octave OS onto a card that will fit both DSJ and DirectStream/PWD will be a challenge. There’s certainly no room left for anything else other than future firmware upgrades. Octave requires a lot of resources including specific cache, enough memory to store the library database and cover art, multiple USB connections (yes, you will be able to connect your USB hard drives directly into Bridge III), internet stack, CPU, and purpose-designed output stage.

We have no doubt a lot of our customers will stay with Roon and that’s fine. Roon is excellent and run by excellent caring people (of which there are too few of in this industry). We support them and wish only the best for them.


#15

Thanks cool


#16

Thanks Paul. One question–once Octave is out, will the DS Jr. be offered in Bridge II (Rood ready) and Bridge III (Octave) versions or just Bridge III?


#17

Yes - thanks for the good information. I kind of feel toward Roon as i do PS Audio - the team is really working hard to develop a community through dedication to superior product development and customer responsiveness. Engagement with clients and a reflection of that in updates and product features seems so rare these days.

Letting out a small breath that Bridge II will continue to see support. I have no complaints about Bridge II and don’t have the vision that Paul and team have, but if Bridge II were to be left behind, and the replacement didn’t support Roon, i would feel left out. What i am hearing is the Bridge II will not be left behind and it’s development will continue. Maybe Bridge III should be called something different?

Is Octave the future? Hard to say, but having dedicated so much time to learning and managing Roon, i can’t really stomach the thought of a switch in the near future.


#18
Paul McGowan said

If you like Roon (and who doesn’t?)…

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I am grateful to PS Audio for my one-year free trial of Roon, which is ending in October, but I would not pay $50 for Roon, much less $500. shaking-head-no-smiley-emoticon_gif

I find Roon to be a messy and unduly restrictive interface that does not sound particularly good. (YMMV, of course.)

What do I prefer? MinimServer side-loaded onto a Melco, driven by Bubble UPnP. The Melco feeds the Bridge II via Ethernet. Better sound than Roon, more stable and, oh yeah, it is free (I donated $20 to MinimServer).

While I would have preferred that the Bridge III support Roon to preserve options, I am so happy with MinimServer and the Bridge II that I am willing to consider the Bridge III/Octave as a potential alternative to MinimServer (assuming Octave can somehow index the FLAC and DSD files on the Melco) as opposed to a Roon alternative.


#19

I, too, find Roon not to sound good. But I have not heard Roon on one of their dedicated ROCK NUC setups.


#20
Elk said

I, too, find Roon not to sound good. But I have not heard Roon on one of there dedicated ROCK NUC setups.


Me three. Best sound to date in my system is JRiver MC managing my digital files…