Not sure but I think Ted said 100Mbps are less noisier than Gigabit converters.
Looking to isolate before DSJ. Please correct me and share your experience.
Also what model:
Not sure but I think Ted said 100Mbps are less noisier than Gigabit converters.
I have read similar worries about gigabit being noisier. In addition, the Bridge II only accepts 100Mbps, so if you use a gigabit optical solution, you have to put a switch before the Bridge, which somewhat defeats the pupose.
The tp-link model is MC110cs, which uses a single core cable. You also have to consider the noise created by the final conversion and the units power supply.
The EtherRegen (release pending) from Uptone is a switch that is designed for isolation. It will take a gigabit optical (as well as other connections) and output a supposedly “clean” 100Mbps signal to the Bridge… it is considerably more expensive though.
Good I did not buy yet…just try to do my homework. I did not know Bridge II only accept 100Mbps. What other media converters you guys are using?
Any particular brand/model?
just a small Bridge II using guy here, it’s fallen out of favor, 100Mbps is way more than enough to pass anything the Bridge II can process.
I should go with a switch instead? I meand which one will do less harm than good?
Power supply noise, conversion noise? Right now DSJ is connected to my router.
The EtherRegen is a switch specifically designed to isolate an audio Ethernet connection. I suspect it will be cleaner than the TP-Link, but have not tried it yet (I am currently using TP-Link with a battery on the final converter to minimize power supply noise).
I would also suggest you search the forum for GigaFOIL -another isolation solution many are enamored with.
Thanks I’m aware about GigaFoil but at $570US…?
I doubt will be 6 times better than 2 converters.
Take a look at SOtM switch. It has 2 optically ports (SFP), and good filter for Ethernet. I am using it, with good results.
Price is not that scary also (albeit expensive).
May I ask what model ?
Picked up an old Cisco Catalyst 100mb switch on eBay for $23. Significant improvement for my streaming sound quality over TP Link and $50 Linksys switch I had been using. Also improved sq of my locally stored music files on my Aurender music server (via DS w/Matrix). Here’s some info if anyone is interested…
I listed it above:
You have to construct the battery source (easy).
I’m wondering if these media converters will really need it in my system configuration.
I’m using an AiMesh network and in my listening room, router is connected to main router over wifi and only DSJ is plugged in one of the LAN ports. Nothing else but is still wifi traffic on this router.
Will I still gain improvement using media converters? Or better just buy a LPS for my router and call it done?
How about where or how close to audio equipment are you keeping these Fibre Media Converters? I’m tempted to use a short rj45 patch for last transfer connection and this mean both MC units stacked together are close to dac…probably sitting on top of DSJ.
FWIW, I use the TP Link converters after my router and before my switch. The switch is on an iFi specialty power supply of appropriate voltage and feeds all of my Ethernet connected kit in my 2.1/7.1, dual-purpose (stereo and HT) system. I run a WireWorld Starlight Cat 8 Ethernet cable from the switch to a Pink Faun LAN Isolator that is plugged into my PSA DirectStream Sr. DAC (Bridge II).
About 15’ of “No-Name” Cat 7 Ethernet cable feeds the switch. The Starlight cable is 2M long.
I am not one to switch stuff in and out and up and down to figure out which configuration sounds the best. I tend to try a tweak based on research and listen for a long time. If I don’t discern a degradation of sound, it stays in for a while. Then, I reverse the change and see if I miss it. The TP-Link and Pink Faun kit has resulted in a quieter system overall to my ears.
You mean more details? You’re not referring to any hiss/hum noise when close to speakers? I mean what exactly is the difference with TP Link converters and without?
Disclaimer: I think these “things” (impacts, benefits, etc.) are somewhat subjective, and very much system and power supply (generally and equipment-wise) - dependent.
That said, “galvanic isolation” has likely resulted in the oft-described “blacker background”, which allows for more low-level detail to be heard. This is not a removal of a clearly heard noise level, like a constant hiss at the speakers, mind you. Rather, it is the presentation of more content during playback.
A specific example: I have a ripped track by Lyle Lovett called North Dakota that is one of my favorite system workout tunes. Two things are improved on that track when the “noise floor” is lowered. One, there are some light and delicate cymbal rolls and taps that either don’t emerge at all from a couple of quiet passages during the song, or are not fully heard. Second, there are some female backing/harmonies (I think it’s Joni Mitchell) that become much clearer and evident as a separate, beautiful voice as a result.
Two further points (since you have asked for details):
These are incremental, subtle improvements to my system that I am describing, not in-your-face, “Holy Cow!” transformational impacts; and
I say “likely” above because my observations have been made in the context of several system variables that I believe have allowed for a “continuous” improvement in “quietness”/resolution over time (i.e, the addition of the TP Link MC’s, the penultimate Snowmass firmware update, the PinkFaun widget and Starlight Ethernet cable).
I can tell you that my system has never been more resolving (further kit details are in my profile) and I believe these tweaks aimed at reducing “network noise” have contributed to the overall improvement.
Last, but most important, point (hackneyed, but true): one has to try these things in their own home to determine their worth and effectiveness. Pick up the PinkFaun or some other device(s) that interest you and have a listen. With today’s robust resale market and generous vendor return policies, you won’t have much to lose.
it just so happens that there is at least one reviewer out there that has tried both and prefers the GigaFoil.
FWIW: DJM Electronics GigaFoilv4 Ethernet filter review.
Let’s talk about noise.
Regardless of the input we use on the DAC, unless something really strange is done, we are going to get the proper data into the DAC and converted to I2S (DAC internal bus). If we use a DAC that handles it’s own clocking (like the DS DACs), then unless something really strange is done, we are going to get only the jitter generated within the DAC. That leaves electrical noise (EMI, RFI, ground loops, etc.) to influence sound quality, and the only thing we can improve short of buying another DAC.
So we can select the input we want to use, and take steps to minimize the noise on that input. I think it is useful to consider the noise in three components: 1) The noise brought to the DAC from the source(s), 2) The noise brought to the DAC from the cabling, and 3) The noise generated in converting the digital signal to I2S. Note that the DS DACs have an I2S input which avoids #3, at least within the DAC.
Let’s apply this to the Ethernet connection which we’ve been discussing.
Galvanic isolation (like a fiber optic run) should eliminate electrical noise prior to the step that creates the downstream ethernet output (the final FMC in the current discussion). So the refined goal is to minimize the noise created at this final step AND during its transmission to the Bridge. The Ethernet cable: There are whole articles written about the minimum length of ethernet cable to use and what type. To minimize the acquisition of electrical noise I fall into the camp of a short run of CAT 7. You will get multiple other opinions. The good news is it is easy to try different ethernet cables and lengths and see what works for you. The power supply of the final conversion: You may want to consider a high quality power supply for your galvanic isolation terminus. The Converter: FMC, Gigafoil, EtherRegen are all viable galvanic isolation methods for Ethernet. They all have their proponents and there may be others.
At some point you may want to consider that another input may create less conversion noise than the Bridge and try that out.
Easy, yes… enjoy the fishing!
Now I know/understand. I just put FMC in my system and it is UNBELIEVABLE.
Drastic change and for good. Is like music coming out of a black hole,way more better separation and air.And details,OMG…pure magic. I was sceptic…boy I was wrong.
I have 100dB speakers and only 2 watts amplifier and even the small noise heard when my ear on the drivers,now is almost gone at all.First was reduced when I ad sBooster for my router,second even more reduced with these FMC.
Both are on 9V iFi Ipower.
Now I am wondering if is better to move the router and 1 FMC out of music room and just use longer fibre cable to audio rack?