Good point st50maint.
Fourlegs, just a general thought: If your hi-fi works without the P10, I’d be very surprised at anything wonky causing the P10 to go into bypass mode. The P10 should be at least as robust, and probably more so than your other equipment, since it’s been designed to fix wonky power.
I think you should work with the UK distributor to sort out your P10. PS Audio really is very good with client / dealer / distributor support.
st50maint saidIf the output distortion is the same as the input distortion, then you are most likely in bypass mode.
I believe st50maint is suggesting to watch the input and distortion figures when the P10 relay clicks. If the P10 relay engages and the P10 simultaneously displays matching input and output distortion figures, it probably is switching into bypass mode.
Of course, if the two match all the time the regenerator has likely failed.
His regenerator is working:
” The usual THD in is about 2% and out is about 0.1%”
The events that can trigger the regenerator to go into bypass mode are out of spec voltages (too high or too low) or a fault condition if the regenerator is malfunctioning.
Paul McGowan saidThe events that can trigger the regenerator to go into bypass mode are out of spec voltages (too high or too low)…
Paul didn’y specify whether the out of spec voltages that would trigger bypass mode were on the input side or output side.
It would make sense that if the output voltages became too high or too low (presumably due to a fault in the P10) then it might well be better to bypass and feed the unaltered input voltages to the output. Even better though might be to switch the outputs off and go into a fault mode.
However, I agree with you that if the input voltage was too high or too low (especially too high) then the last thing that you would want would be for that to be dumped straight through in bypass mode to the output. I would much prefer the P10 to switch off the outputs and report the fault on screen.
The devil of stuff such as this is often in the detail and a definition of too high or too low would be useful and clarification of whether it applies to input or output voltages.
Actually, Brodric’s correct and I misspoke. The unit shuts itself off if the input voltage exceeds the limit it cannot regulate safely to. I apologize. Modern Power Plants bypass very little and I should check with Bob, the main Power Plant Engineer to be more accurate. Truth is I haven’t kept up with some of the decisions for protection as well as I should have. When the staff gets back on Tuesday I’ll do some investigating and get it sorted out.
Many thanks. I will leave with you.
Just as an adjunct to my initial questions in post number 1 of this thread about the relays clicking in my P10, I have today been sitting in the same room for a couple of hours as the P10. The P10 is powered up but all zones are switched off. In other words the P10 is not powering anything and hasn’t for several hours.
The P10 periodically emits the sound of a quiet relay from within it. The input voltage is a steady 248V and the output voltage is set to 240V and maintains a steady 239V. The input THD is about 2% and it is showing 0.1% THD output.
I will probably have to wait until some tech staff from PS Audio get into the office in the new year but all I want to know is whether this behaviour is completely normal.
Does anyone else’s P10 do this relay clicking or are they all silent? Should I take mine to a dealer to get checked out or can PS Audio connect to the P10 remotely to look at it’s logs?
The P10 seems to do everything it is meant to and if it is normal for it to have internal relays clicking then thats fine. However if it is not normal then I need to let the guy I bought it from know that there might be a problem.
My PowerPlants are quiet (or at least quiet enough I do not hear them click). Thus, I suspect something is not quite right.
Paul indicated he would look into it. I would check back with him mid-week.
Please let us know what you learn.
Fourlegs said ..... Voltage in varies between 245V and 253V.....
Thanks, NickFourlegs/Nick,
you don’t need to get too precise…but where are you based? UK (Oz, Irish, channel isles,) voltage are nominally 230, you are seeing 245~253.
The advice I got day one was to set output at the nominal/middle of the range voltage. Though Paul seems to say something a bit different in a post?
Elk saidMy PowerPlants are quiet (or at least quiet enough I do not hear them click). Thus, I suspect something is not quite right.
Paul indicated he would look into it. I would check back with him mid-week.
Please let us know what you learn.
But you are right I am sure Paul will take this up with his colleagues. I will leave him alone until later next week.
blackicehurts saidFourlegs/Nick,
you don’t need to get too precise…but where are you based? UK (Oz, Irish, channel isles,) voltage are nominally 230, you are seeing 245~253.
The advice I got day one was to set output at the nominal/middle of the range voltage. Though Paul seems to say something a bit different in a post?
No, the nominal voltage in the UK is not 230V. That was just an EU fudge so we and the rest of Europe could be on the same nominal voltage. Hence why the EU (and UK) standard for the voltage is 230V -6% +10% because that brought the UK voltage of 240V within that range and also accommodated the other various voltages in Europe. The introduction of the 230V standard did not mean that we changed our actual voltage which remains at a nominal 240V. Historically pre EU the UK voltage was 240V + or - 6%. The 253V supply voltage I am seeing is therefore within the power company supply spec but only just.
I understand. But am certain Paul is watching this, and other, threads. He will look into it.
And do not worry about bugging him.
Indeed. The crew’s back on Tuesday after a long 10 day holiday. Our longest ever.
Hello
I skimmed this and want to say, no, clicking is not normal. Previous to the P10 I had a Niagara 5000 and noticed when I plugged a Mac Mini into it, it would make the clicking noise you referred. I pulled this from the two dedicated circuits I had and installed it to my server room, well away from my Audio room and it’s dedicated circuits. When I did that no more clicking.
So not sure what your running, but I would go through what you have on there, even though it may not be on, something may be on in standby mode or perhaps you have a computer like I did. Today, only audio equipment is in my circuit, and all plays well! I hope this was not said earlier, and it helps!
Fourlegs saidJust as an adjunct to my initial questions in post number 1 of this thread about the relays clicking in my P10, I have today been sitting in the same room for a couple of hours as the P10. The P10 is powered up but all zones are switched off. In other words the P10 is not powering anything and hasn’t for several hours.
The P10 periodically emits the sound of a quiet relay from within it. The input voltage is a steady 248V and the output voltage is set to 240V and maintains a steady 239V. The input THD is about 2% and it is showing 0.1% THD output.
I will probably have to wait until some tech staff from PS Audio get into the office in the new year but all I want to know is whether this behaviour is completely normal.
Does anyone else’s P10 do this relay clicking or are they all silent? Should I take mine to a dealer to get checked out or can PS Audio connect to the P10 remotely to look at it’s logs?
The P10 seems to do everything it is meant to and if it is normal for it to have internal relays clicking then thats fine. However if it is not normal then I need to let the guy I bought it from know that there might be a problem.
Thanks for reaching out to us and sorry to hear that you are having this trouble.
The P10 is equipped with a Buck / Boost board to adjust for various AC input levels.
If the input voltage exceeds 10 VAC above the output level setting the relay will click to make the adjustment.
One test you can try is to increase the output voltage to 242 VAC and listen for the click.
If you continue to have trouble please reach out to us at service@psaudio.com
We’ll get you in touch to your distributor for service.
Thanks in advance,
Jeremy B said If the input voltage exceeds 10 VAC above the output level setting the relay will click to make the adjustment.What adjustment is being made when the relay clicks?
Jeremy, thanks for your reply. Are you saying it is possible therefore that I might set the output voltage initially to be within 10V of input voltage but that if the input voltage rises so that it exceeds 10v higher than the output voltage an internal relay will be activated to cope with that greater than 10V difference? If so, that would account for me hearing relays clicking in and out through the day. My input voltage does vary through the day as can be seen from the attached typical log.
Nick
