If your reread the post you cite you will discover it was not in any way a reprimand, rather it merely points out others disagree with what you think is a reasonable political position. Amsco15 described it as airbrushing history; you, a modest gesture to avoid reliving that history. Politics is an incendiary topic so we avoid it here.
You are free to discuss Mr. Baker’s poor behavior, or not, as you see fit.
I see, so it is okay to hate on Ginger Baker for boorishness, Miles Davis for spousal abuse, Eric Clapton for racism, and Roger Waters and Richard Wagner for antisemitism, but don’t say anything bad about the Confederate flag. Got it, thanks for that clarification.
Elk - having just read this thread for the first time, I guess the thing is that it sounds like you have personal experience with Ginger Baker - or his behavior strikes such a chord with you - your reaction seems so visceral. Yeah - imbalanced, messed up…great drummer - kinda like many rock drummers to varying degrees, both in messed-uppedness and talent ; )
The question that springs to mind to me is, is it then then a positive thing in your estimation that (to take one example) my order for the colored vinyl version of the first of three Ryan Adams albums that were slated to be released this year was canceled, and it would seem nothing is to be released?
It’s a short step from there to discussing the behavior of other sorts of public figures - as it seems harder than ever to know where and how to draw the line on their behavior. Does this mean that we should not be able to benefit from a troubled artists’ good works, or that they should not be able to profit from the positive things they create?
For example, having a vague notion of your tastes, are you a Placido Domingo fan? Or should I say were you?
This is just a general thought springing from the banter with Boot.
Sorry to see him go.
But, what do you call a guy who hangs around with musicians? A drummer.
The distinction is easy. We have long kept discussions of politics out of this forum. As I noted above, politics is an incendiary topic unrelated to audio and music so we avoid it. There are many forums for discussing politics if this is one’s interest.
On topic: Mr. Baker’s behavior was far, far beyond “boorishness” as you term it.
Query: Why do you continue to downplay his long-term well-documented routinely violent and cruel behavior? That is, why are you playing the role of apologist?
I understand preferring not to discuss his ugly acts, but why the active attempts to minimize them?
A superb question with which many have struggled. Similarly, do we take advantage of data gathered from involuntary experiments on prisoners?, etc.
My view is one should be aware of the whole person and weigh such variables as we each individually see fit. An R.I.P. thread is precisely where one takes measure of a man. Hiding from our obscuring meaningful truth is always harmful.
I was never much of a Placido Domingo fan so this one is easy. 
There are unfortunately a handful of other well known classical performers/conductors with suspect behaviors. I understand the allegations are credible. Very sad.
I have no view of Ryan Adams, barely even recognizing the name. But I will look him up.
Well - pick someone whose music you do like. Do you stop liking their music on principle when they are shown to be evil? I guess that’s the question.
Wow, Elk. Did Ginger Baker kill your dog and sleep with your wife? Because you sure sound that angry…give it a rest.
I was not discussing “politics.” I was pointing out that Lucinda Williams had a Confederate flag on her leather jacket sleeve in the unretouched picture on her “Lucinda Williams” album cover, that the flag had been airbrushed out on the album cover, and that I agreed with the decision to airbrush out the flag. I wrote: “I love this album, and I am glad they airbrushed the Confederate flag patch sewn to her jacket sleeve.”
In short, I was commenting on an album cover in the “What are you spinning right now?” thread, which is made up overwhelmingly of album covers posted by forum members. Seemed like fair comment at the time.
In this thread, I have referred to Ginger Baker as “cantankerous,” “irascible,” ‘boorish’ and an “ass” (the last one was quoting you). A scan of a random sample of the many tributes and obituaries that have been published in recent days confirms that my characterizations are ‘in the ballpark.’ Sorry if you do to not think these adjectives are strong enough.
Ginger Baker’s bad acts are well-documented and he did not deny them, so I do not understand why you think I am trying to minimize those acts. Frankly, the more interesting question is: Why do you feel the need to bash Ginger Baker at every turn (and less than 24 hours after he died, no less)? What did Ginger Baker ever do to you that you feel compelled to remind people of his personal failings anytime any of us mention his music in a positive light? I have not seen you do this with any other musician.
No, it is not. It’s not honorable to speak Ill of the dead right after they die. If you don’t have anything nice to say, keep it to yourself. If you feel so inclined, create a thread in a week or two and rip the man there.
Does anyone remember when Michael Jackson died, he went immediately from deviate, perverted creep to artistic genius?
I can’t compete with any of them either musically or creepily, but at least nobody is making movies about my failings🤷🏻♂️
Reminds me of George Carlin re funerals. ‘He was an a$$hole…but a well meaning a$$hole’.
No, he was a deviate perverted creep that was also a musical genius. But, I didn’t need to point out he was a perverted creep in threads right when he died.
Now here’s true wisdom folks…
“Don’t focus on the speck in your brother’s eye while ignoring the log in your own eye.”
I was putting a pile of records away last night and came across some Cream albums, including Goodbye Cream. I was wondering how they got him to put on that suit. He does look manic at the bast of times. Cream comes not long after Blakey in by alpha filing system and I was thinking I’d rather Blakey than Baker. Just found this video. Whilst Blakey is a truly skilful and controlled drummer, Baker just seems possessed with flashes of sheer brilliance.
With regard to his general demeanour, given he was the son of a Lewisham bricklayer, I wouldn’t have expected anything less. Jack Bruce had a proper disciplined musical education and the other guy came from very posh Surbiton, all a bit strange really.
Thanks for that.
When I was young I was in awe of Isaac Newton. Possibly the greatest scientist who had ever lived. I would have loved to be another Newton. Then I started to read biographical information about him. A profoundly unpleasant man. I became very glad not to be a second Newton. The fact remains that his contributions to human understanding were immense.
So is the big disagreement here - how much time should elapse before it’s appropriate to discuss both the failings and accomplishments of an artist in public? A parallel cultural consideration that is developing for institutions is - how much time needs to elapse before “an artist with issues” can be openly appreciated again. After the NY Times published articles about the artist Chuck Close making unwanted advances towards models, the National Gallery cancelled a retrospective last year. I read op-ed pieces where critics say they have to hide their James Levine recordings now. Richard Wagner, the favorite composer of the Third Reich, didn’t have his music performed by a full orchestra in Israel until 2012. Most culturally aware museum goers know that Picasso was an abusive philandering husband and Caravaggio was a murderer, but we don’t let that lessen our appreciation for their art. Seems that time does dim memories of the worst of behaviors. I suppose we all hope we’re remembered for our successes rather than our failings.
While I appreciate Speed-racer’s respect for decorum, public figures are subject to more scrutiny and that’s just the reality in today’s world.
Homosexuality was perfectly OK in Ancient Greece, but we don’t hold it against the great philosophers.
Times change. Wagner may have been an anti-Semite, but that was pretty standard behaviour for the time. When Mahler was trying to get appointed in Vienna the mayor was a raging anti-Semite. Mahler responded by championing Wagner’s music, including a full Ring cycle. As a Jew I avoided Wagner, until Anish Kapoor agreed to design a new production of Tristan und Isolde, which I went to as the music is symphonic and is considered the foundation stone for the Late Romantics, the greatest of whom is probably Mahler, who not only played Wagner for to prove itself a true German, but was heavily influenced by it. There were other Jewish conductors at the time who were happy to play Mahler.
Karajan was another matter. He joined the Nazi party early on and although cleared of crimes after the war, he was always considered a pretty dedicated Nazi. As he was appointed for life to the Berlin Philharmonic, they were never invited to Israel until he was dead and buried, when a tour was fairly quickly arranged and the opening concert in Tel Aviv was attended by the Presidents of both Israel and Germany. I went to the one in Jerusalem, Zubin Mehta conducting with Itzak Perlman playing the Beethoven violin concerto. At the end of the concert everyone stood and the orchestra played Hatikvah. That was the single most emotional experience of my life. The death of a truly talented but malign individual had provided closure for a nation of music-lovers.