The combination of dialing in a sub by room response measurements and final finetuning by ear is essential also for me. At the end much quicker and better than trying to do by ear alone. And measurements often show much unexpected results of some settings changing things in another direction than presumed.
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My dealer came round and integrated my subwoofer (which I no longer use). The amplifier system can be programmed for full-range, high and low pass filters. He recommended to leave it full range.
Even my little Bluesound Powernode 2i has high pass filter options for subwoofer integration - which I do use in my office.
The REL has various knobs on the back (left them alone after the dealer left) to change these things.
I would have thought most modern systems have this level of programmable control for subwoofer integration.
The high pass filter can only be turned on or off. You cannot vary the frequency which, from memory, is 60 Hz. If used with the P3ESRs (I know you no longer have these) then you get a ‘hole’ between 60 and 75Hz. I use a high level connection with filter off because of this.
Actually spec says: Frequency response: 29Hz–33kHz, ±2dB on reference. Frequency range: –6dB at 25Hz and 36kHz.
I sold my subs long ago and never missed them.
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You can change the high pass filter. That said, I just dug out the high level cable and plugged it in into the REL S2, switched off the Bluesound subwoofer output, turned the crossover on the REL to about 80Hz (given Raidho X1 in use) and the output fairly low. Then got the UMIK mic and dialled it in a little. The room is untreated save for files and books. I was only a couple of notches down on volume, but had to turn the crossover way up to get a reasonable response - as can be seen increasing one or two clicks at a time.
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Interesting thread. I had a Martin Logan Dynamo subwoofer installed for use when I had a AVR system. Pulled it out when I went back to 2-channel. Never considered using it for music, just movie viewing.
I have Monitor Audio Gold floorstanders. Bass delivery meets my needs.
That’s the great thing about this hobby with so many variables available.
I’ll add my voice to the pro subs folks. My Focal 948’s have pretty good Bass but adding a pair of subs added something I like. Not just louder bass but a richer more appealing sound. Bottom line is one’s taste, if you’re cool with your system with or without subs you’ve achieved what you want.
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Curious – what was your dealer’s process for dialing in the subs?
A magic disc and his ears.
He delivered a pair of Wilson last week. In about 3 or 4 months when they are in another room I will get him to bring a REL S/812 round and set up the speakers and see what impact the S/812 has before deciding whether or not to buy one, plus the wife may object to a black lump in her new room.
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It has been quite a while since I visited here. The purpose of this post is to once again suggest that you evaluate your source preference when trying to decide if subs will benefit your system. Paul and I debated this quite awhile back. Paul likes subs without reservation. He also listens mostly to classical music and prefers digital sources if memory serves. While I have those things, I am more of a vinyl guy and listen to a lot of old jazz recordings made from the 1920s, 30s, 40s, 50s and 60s. Not a lot of bass in my preferred sources. With that as back ground, I recently bought a pair of REL 212/SX speakers. Paul is right that they add a tremendous sense of depth, impact and excitement if the source material has signal below say 40-50 cps. As you might guess, however, my old jazz recordings do not excite my new REL speakers at all. As in nothing coming out, nada. Which, in all fairness is exactly what I expected. Am I happy with the RELs? Yes, but I went into this with realistic expectations. Nobody seems to discuss this important factor in the decision process.
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I don’t know about everyone else, but my musical taste spans practically all genres.
Despite having floorstanders that could go down to -3dB at 20hz, it was when I read testimonies from others who integrated subs that I decided to try it out.
Suffice to say, for anyone who is on the fence – it’s worth trying it out.
Things like foot stomps from live recordings of flamenco performances will have a dimension of realism that can’t be heard without them – and so will a lot of other well recorded world music that don’t rely solely on instruments.
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Local dealer has $109k Wilson Audio Alexx speakers displayed, and told me even they benefit from a good (or two) REL subwoofer(s).
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While I would agree with you that “it is worth trying it out” that goes for most things. At the same time, if your floor standing speakers are -3db at 20 hz and your subs add anything to what you are hearing, your subs might be turned up too much. For me, while I will give a listen to anything, my preference and most of my listening is to acoustic jazz up to and through the bebop period. Charlie Parker did not stomp on the floor in cowboy boots while he was playing. And that is my point really, people need to evaluate their listening habits and preferences as part of their decision process.
If your sub doesn’t have a parametric EQ, you have to place it, so that the peak it produces in your room is as weak as possible. Then you have to turn it a bit louder than you would have done with the peak and it will add more ambiance information also to recordings which have no noticeable bass below 40Hz or so.
Remember, the benefit of a sub is not (only) to add frequency extension to your speakers, but mainly to add an add. source of deep sound waves to your room (which will do it’s thing to ambiance).
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Have him bring two.
I found my subwoofer added presence to Mingus’ bass, but on many other things like Baroque and various chamber music the sub was doing nothing and sometimes switched off.
The subs are dialed in quite right, but I misspoke – I meant to say “feeling” as opposed to “hearing”.
We upgrade our speakers and equipment to be delighted by new experiences we previously haven’t heard, or felt, before.
And I would argue that we can’t experience something we don’t render. It’s tough to assume it’s not there to render when we haven’t tried – with respect to each individual’s music libraries.
I do wonder if there’s a database of album frequency ranges that could help people make the decision.
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One will be more than enough. It may be too much. Subwoofers are ugly. Very, very ugly.
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You are supposed to be listening to them not making love to them. 
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