The Cost of US Products Overseas

Everything Else
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Not all PS Audio products are made in the US, the sprout seems to such an example, and most products are claimed to be assembled in the US so what percentage come from Asia and what percentage of parts of PS audio equipment are actually manufactured in the US remains a mystery anyway.

Regardless, I am also referring to technical products made in EU and USA. German cars for example are cheaper in the US than here in Europe, by smart business models. Swiss watches, also mostly cheaper in the US than heat in Europe.

And even the Harbeths that Badbeef referred to as bad example of EU products Exported to the US never added 43% to the MRSP when shipped to the US. It was 30 % and I agree with Badbeef that it indeed is a bad example. But PS Audio and it’s sales channel (German or EU in this case) seems to dare to make it even worse.

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@Rudolf_Appel has a point because import costs into Europe are relatively cheap, duty is only about 3% and shipping costs are low for units like Stellar.

More significantly, prices between UK and mainland Europe should not invite EU customers to buy from the UK, which is very easy to do online and shipping is minimal (it’s by road), because PSA has different distributors in the UK and EU.

The fact is that €4,000 for a Class D all-in-one is not really a competitive price compared to, for example, the AVM CS2.2, that is about the same price, offers a lot more power and functionality and has a nice brushed steel finish.

So I might consider the Stellar at the UK price, but not the EU price, especially given AVM is made locally and is a very popular. I would just get the AVM.

PS Audio’s 70% USA sales makes it a very domestic focused company. Compare to Naim in the UK, has sales of about $50m, only 35% in the UK, 40% in EU and 25% in Rest of the World.

Because European domestic markets are so much smaller, to become a sizeable company they really have to be very focused on their export pricing.

1 Like
44

if i got it honored i will not receive any more PS products

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Steven

I already referred him to the new Gold Note unit months ago which is why it’s obvious he’s not looking to buy anything but only feels the need to keep beating this dead horse. There are more EU, UK and Taiwan products that fit the bill than you can count but he continues to ignore that fact and keeps on. I’m personally not interested in a product of that type regardless of who makes it. I have an Italian Audia Flight integrated in my Office system that came with a fully adjustable phono stage but that is only because it was the distributors show demo and he didn’t want to bother taking the plug in phono board out so he threw it in with the deal so I took it. Not something I needed or have used. I want my phono and digital parts separate.

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Jack STOP IT PLEASE,

I was or still am very much interested in expending into the Stellar system, I bought the Stellar Gain Cell DAC.

That is just less than a year ago. Just started High End Audio first time ever I spent 1.800,00 EURO on a pre amplifier with DAC and over 500 EURO on cables. Saved the money up which took nearly 2 years and paid upon pickup without taking a loan.

Honest and fair business.

Indeed I need time to safe for another set, if EUR 2.300,00 take me 2 years it is not hard to imagine how long EUR 3.200,00 or EUR 4.000,00 take to safe together.

Based on Paul Mc Gowan’s statements that the Stellar system is for those who need to watch their budget I bought a piece of Stellar equipment and since every Stellar device SGCD, S300 and M700 at that time was around EUR 2.000,00 I thought it was safe to buy into the PS Audio offerings with the intent to expand.

Please Refrain from responding to my posts and constantly insulting me, while I provide evidence and facts.

How on earth can you tell people here who I am and what I am going to do or not do.

It is your behavior that scares me and I am certain many newcomers to high end audio away.

If that was your goal, you have achieved it. If you are or are liaised to one of the companies profiting from the EU price policies of PS Audio, you certainly must have understood this message, considering the way you react.

But If you are somebody who obviously has no problem paying for the even more expensive BHK or direct stream equipment I do not understand why bother to read or just half read this thread an jump on individuals who simply have to watch their budget.

This is certainly NOT what I bargained for when I believed Paul Mc Gowan and decided to buy the Stellar Gain Cell DAC.

So please refrain from answering my posts.

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@Rudolf_Appel has a very good point. Alan Shaw has run Harbeth extremely successfully for over 30 years from the standpoint that the best quality sound should be available to all, and that AVERAGE full time earnings after tax in the UK and Europe are around $35,000. So a product like the BHK Pre-amp that costs £6,300 (about $9,000) is only going to be looked at by people earning in the top 3% to 5% of earners in the population, if they are interested at all.

So, with the exception of their single large speaker, all Harbeth’s products are in the range £1,900 to £5,000, or €2,200 to €5,550 in Europe. These prices are almost exactly the same at the current exchange rate. In the USA they are $2,500 to $7,500, but USA dealers take a bigger margin. They produce a world class sound and the express intention is that people of modest means should feel confident that if they save up, perhaps for a few years, they will get a high quality product that will last many years.

To win that market confidence, there has to be consistent pricing, because €3,000 may be affordable but €4,000 is a very different ballpark. If PSA are going to operate in the mid-market in the UK and Europe, they have to be very aware of pricing and to have such a difference between the UK and EU makes no sense.

In the UK market, the SGCD seems a competitive product, possibly the Stellar Strata, but it has a lot of quality competition. The Stellar Phono is attractive, but there are a host of well established local products that are cheaper and I don’t think reducing the Stellar Phono price would make any difference. In the UK the Stellar Phono is not a mid-market product so I don’t understand why it is in the Stellar range. In the UK the phono costs £2,500, for which you can get a Rega P8 with Alpheta 3, which is a complete high-end turntable.

So whereas Stellar is generally in the mid-market in the USA (so it seems), it is slightly above that in the UK and EU, as shown by the Strata and Phono pricing.

If you are going to make a price-conscious product line like Stellar, I would expect a DAC/pre and phono amp to be about the same price, the phono pre possibly a but cheaper. In the UK the SGCD is £1,600 and the phono £2,500. I suspect the problem is that Darren designed a device that is better than the Stellar range deserves, which would be a failing in the original design brief.

2 Likes
48

That is what I tried to get across, thank you Stephen.

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I do get your point and I get your frustration I can see the disparity in pricing/cost, etc.

A product you would like to own but a product that costs more than you can comfortably afford to pay out, but, this happens in all walks of life. And sadly that’s the way it is, what do you expect to change … Do you think the intrinsic value of the product set by PS Audio to change … Or the pricing structure out with the US to change.

If the product is too expensive then you have to look elsewhere. That’s just the way it is! I do see/feel your frustration. But I cannot see why you keep banging out the same old tune!

One option: Can you not buy direct from PS Audio - but you will have to pay VAT, import duties, etc. Recently I bought something from Australia and brought it into the UK, product cost $4000 AUD, I received an invoice from TNT for £495.20 for all custom charges, etc. That’s the price one has to pay …

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50

Can we give this a rest? I know many of us are stuck at home but surely we have better things to talk about.

I’ve done my best to help you understand the pricing differences of how this works and why. We do not operate our business in the same way many of the EU based companies do.

As Steven has pointed out, their home markets are much smaller than their export markets. The opposite of what we face.

Rudolph, you’ve had your say. Let’s let it go and move on.

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51

Off course Dirk you are right, the cross however are in the fact that the Stellar series was advertised by the senior management of PS Audio for budget minded persons and if then the price of new releases in that series than doubles within a year, that advertising campaign was rather misleading. And I regret having bought into it.

Your tips about purchasing in the country of origin are good, I will take that in mind.

Considering the negative feedback from PS Audio on the issue of keeping the prices in a certain budget range and avoiding excessive export/import fees on top of the MRSP I certainly look for other also very good options.

It is a pitty as initially I considered PS Audio as a very innovative company close to their customer, which is yet mostly true.

But this voice about limited budgets and the QA issues reported here and that I encountered with the one PS Audio I purchased make my “Japanese Pizza Boxes” (the AV receiver is a Calzone) shine.

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Yes, buy buy PS Audio.

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Does it mean we will no longer see you in the forum? If so, I will thank you in advance.

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Based on quite a few reports contained within the forums here for many years, the service in that market is rubbish. Which is why they reach out to PS Audio directly for help.

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Hi Paul,

I am extremely concerned on the statement that PS Audio’s domestic customers (70%) are paying lower prices at the expense of us who are living outside of the USA (30%).

Could you confirm or correct my understanding?