Ohhh, I HATE when that happens. Hope you’re on the mend
Recently went through that conundrum. I made the “mistake” of talking to Bob of BJC (just kidding, Bob) who convinced me that I should really listen to a “full loom” (DSD>pre as well as pre>amps) of TPC and ETPC to get a full understanding of the sonic differences. He was 100% right, but the result was some significant damage to the budget.
As regards the speaker cables, I also noticed more pronounced sibilants with the TPC set. For a variety of reasons (mainly speaker type and room acoustic charateristics) this was not a good thing for me.
What I haven’t seen mentioned is any perceived differences in how the soundstage projects into the room. In my case, the TPC’s created a wide, deep soundstage with slightly more precise placement of “voices” within it. But the soundstage had a front “boundary” that was strictly left to right along the plane of the speakers. With the SPTPC’s the perception of that front “boundary” dissolved and there was more of a sense of being transported to the recording venue, with nothing separating the listener from the performers, especially with well-done live recordings. There was some trade-off with larger “dots” as Galen described to me, but the overall effect was more lifelike to my ears and IMS.
I didn’t fully appreciate that until I stopped “listening” for differences between the cables and just listened, if you know what I mean. But it’s one of those things that you can’t “unhear” once you hear it.
Ca-ching. (sigh) But like cardri, there is a huge fork stuck in my loom. …
…although Bob reminded me that Iconclast will give you full credit for one year following purchase for well cared for cables if you decide to trade up.
Very well put. I get much the same with my impressions of TPC vs. SPTPC. However, in my case that “bit of extra” done by the SPTPC in the upper frequencies doesn’t seem quite right, even given the soundstage “breaking free of the speakers” improvement. With the SPTPC I feel as though I’m listening more to “things” rather than “music”.
This is a very interesting discussion! I haven’t made a commitment to invest in Iconoclast cables just yet, but I’m sure that I will give them a try at some point next year. For now, I’m trying to stay content with less expensive cables that perform pretty well in my system.
When I did some extended comparisons of mid-priced XLRs several months back, I found it very helpful to look at the “fatigue factor” of each XLR I was comparing. To do that, I stopped listening for sonic gymnastics and dramatic musical passages and just let myself listen to music for as long as I wanted with each cable. In the process, I found myself getting lost in the music with the better cables and wanting to switch out the lesser cables asap. This is a great way to figure out which cable is more pleasing and natural in your own system without overthinking the process too much.
@hthaller-Once I shake this head cold I should be able to do a proper evaluation of the TPC and SPTPC speaker cables. You make a valid point regarding the soundstage, and instrument placement within the image. I’ll need to move speakers around based on introducing the Iconoclast cables.
The way you describe your listening tests resonates with me - I have found that if I try to rapidly swap out cables in an objective attempt to hear specific changes, I have difficulty distinguishing differences. That is not so say that listening for some specific things, like sibilance or the shimmer of a cymbal strike haven’t sometimes borne out differences in cables. But giving into the emotions of the music, while listening for extended periods of days or weeks, similar to how you describe the fatigue factor, has worked much better for me in picking the “right cables”. I know that sounds kind of hokey, but the preferable cables are the ones that you make you want to listen longer - that make you want to stay in front of the system. Such an extended listening approach was the only way I could reliably differentiate between USB cables when I landed on the Wireworld Platinum Starlight (although I profess I don’t do this kind of blind thing often). I am currently in the process of swapping out power cables for Shunyata Sigmas and Alphas, which produced the kind of improvement I (and some of you) found with the STPC speaker cables in my system.
Ironically, I live in Lansing, MI and went to college at U of M. Who knew there were this many Michigan folks on the forums here…
What’s somewhat fascinating is that in more than one discussion of these cables, there is overall agreement on the objective description of sonics, but then divergence in what works best/sounds most natural for individuals.
Somewhere, Galen mentioned that in one of his systems, he uses TPC throughout as the best sounding, but in the other it was UPOCC and SPTPC. The approach that SDL and rfajardo describe is the right way to go, for sure. It’s more or less what Bob and Galen recommend, as well.
If the TPC works best in your setup, count your blessings. You won the audio lotto.
I recently bought a pair of BAV balanced cables from Bob, and I use them between my dac and M700’s. I didn’t really expect a lot of difference but I was pleasantly surprised at the clarity and separation I heard once they were in place. I’m still on the fence about Iconoclast speaker cables, as they’re really more than I want to spend. By the way, I live in Michigan too. I’ve lived all over the state but am retired and living in the northern lower peninsula.
While not a yooper, I went to Michigan Tech and have a second home in da UP. Our main home is in the Detroit area. Spend a lot of time in the summer up there, but my wife and I said we aren’t retiring up there, the winters are too dark and we’d be isolated from a lot of “cultural” things.
Grew up in southeast Michigan as well! Didn’t go to U of M because my parent said “oh that would be great you can live at home!” Ended up at Purdue, so go big ten.
And to keep this on topic. I’ve now been convinced to audition iconoclast cables. I’ll start with xlr’s in the next few months.
We almost bought a retirement place in Manistique but decided against it mainly due to the 9 month long winters. It is pretty country though. A good friend is from Copper Harbor. Now that is a real winter!
The verdict is in, at least for the SPTPC, in my system. It just is not a synergistic match. The HF contribution seems artificial in my system, and the “larger dots” do too much to slightly deconstruct the image outlines. The left to right spread, however, is phenomenal. But I can’t listen to impressive features all day. The TPC is more suitable for my rig, but the OFE continues to bring a satisfying musical balance over these other two. The TPC is “not quite enough”. The SPTPC is “a little too much”. The OFE is just “listening to music”. But as I said above, I have one more cable in the mix, and it is proving to be a formidable contender next to the OFE. The fight continues tomorrow! But for now -
But like cardri, there is a huge fork stuck in my loom. …
