Belden ICONOCLAST Interconnects and Speaker Cabling

Cables
5567

The ICONOCLAST cable line was initially designed around modern TPC copper as I knew how good it is, and the leverage was put into the DESIGN. This makes a far, far better performing cable than the random use of esoteric materials. We being audiophiles, after hearing the TPC version, everyone wanted the material to be upped. Well, we did that but in no way will you hear the leap in performance you will using the right designs from the get go. But, again as audiophiles, any improvements are a good thing. We provided those choices even in series I and II. I use the TPC series II on my CLX as an example. They sound excellent.

For those on a budget, getting the full TPC loom, series I or II RCA or XLR pre to power and series I or II speaker cables is a better performing link than just the OFE or SPTPC speaker cable and OFE or UPOCC RCA or XLR by themselves. We have a very accomodating matrix of refinment that is absolutely real. I wouldn’t do it if it wasn’t really better in measure or calculation. Now the hard part, does it help? How far can the betterments be of use? But, we know we are comparing true improvements.

I was very surprised how well the TPC hold it’s own after the paper work was made into product, and I still am! We try to have a product 80% of enthusiasts can afford and that gets you 90% of the benefits. Good design is a lot lower cost than exotic materials that aren’t electromagnetically used properly. All the papers kind of illustrate the difficulty making things work out as all the attributes tend to work against each other. And, I illustrate the true changes in each cable and why I did what I did. You deserve to know.

The ICONOCLAST cables have made me extremely happy, and I pay it foreward to you to enjoy how I can listen to music using them. And yes, your stuff is better than you think and my cables are an excercise in being as close to “nothing” as I can provide. Sometimes nothing is good!

Reactions to the cables is interesting because we should be reserved about what most cables can do. But most cables don’t have the design chops ICONOCLAST does. It makes a difference and I was even astounded having heard the first final design. So here we are!

Best, Galen

5568

Wow, I had the DQ-10 mirror image with the PP yellow caps and the KEF tweeter mod (remove the Motarolla PIZZO and the CTS hard dome (if I remember the sources right) and replace them with the KEF tweeter. I also use the DQ-1W with the LP-1 electronic cross-over. Kenwood LO-7M mono amps on the bass and Apt 1 amps strapped mono on the DQ-10.

These speakers for the day actually IMAGED pretty good! Bass with the subs for the day was also better than most. The foam surround woofer was weak and fragile, so look after that driver often! Replace it with a butyl rubber surround version. The electrolytic caps version blew up as the speakers are like 83 db SPL. Lots of average power even at moderate volumes. The DQ-10 started a little too cost concious and got better over time.

Best, Galen

5569

I had a DQ-1W that I ran with these for awhile but I was using their passive crossover. Can’t say I was very impressed with the combo, they didn’t seem to go very low either. Later I replaced them with a Velodyne sub which I use to this day. IMO pairing with a good sub elevates these to a whole other level.

5570

Here’s a factor we seldom really consider. How are our EARS alike at what we hear and comment on? I mean how accurate are our ears? Mine don’t hear the same at all between them, thanks to a fire cracker put on my right shoulder in high school and lit, unaware to me until it exploded. So yep, my recent “reference” hearing test at 68 shows the expected suck-out in the upper presence region (1-5 KHz region). Strangely, my right ears higher frequencies are fine. My Right ear is more typical for my age with the roll-off above 8KHz. Where my one ear is bad, the other one is OK, so suprimposed my hearing is average for my age. Clearly (pun there) I can’t hear “accurately” relative to anyone else that has perfect hearing.

I for sure, and probably you, do not hear like anyone else. How I feel a system sounds is entirely different and how could it not be? Even a “perfect” system (no such thing) will still be different in my head than yours and yours than mine. There is no common ground with the reference (you and me) being different. I won’t ever say a system is too bright before someone with perfect hearing as an example. Even then, someone with perfect hearing my like even more treble than my older ears. We don’t just STOP at instrumented “ideals” we add our taste to the mix.

We often, and not on purpose, assume we all hear the same system in front of us. We don’t. Sure, adding more treble is heard by all but the amount of the boost perceived to be good or bad is a variable between us all. We manage to communicate what we hear, and assume we are describing exactly what someone else will hear and that just simple sonic taste is at stake. Nope. The starting point, our ears, just isn’t the same. This invariably allows so many speakers to be highly regarded but still vastly different.

Galen

PS - I do add +2dB to my treble!

5571

So—full disclosure, because it matters—I should describe the system, my system, in which the Iconoclast cables made such a HUGE difference, along with today’s replacement values.

Atma-Sphere MA-1 Mk. 3.2 monoblocks→Mk. 3.3 $20,800
Vandersteen 5A Carbon speakers→KĒNTO Carbon speakers  $47,000
Analysis Plus bi-wire Oval 9 speaker cables 8’  $1,620
Analysis Plus Solo Crystal Oval XLR interconnects 3m  $1,350

As you can see, my old cables, while not exactly crappy, were clearly not top-of-the line. Analysis Plus, I think, makes some perfectly cromulent cables. They’re well constructed with high grade connectors and copper. As I recall, their shtick is that their braided hollow oval conductors mitigate reactance, a very desirable feature in audio cables. I replaced a set of Kimber speaker cables (I don’t remember the model) for my then Vandersteen 3A Signatures with Analysis Plus, with an obviously better result. That was before I upgraded to the 5A Carbons, after which I just ordered a bi-wire set of the APs because I’d been happy with them before. My system sounded a lot better with the upgraded speakers, and I didn’t give the cables another thought. Until now.

So, the lesson I learned is that cables can make, not just an uptick of difference, but a spectacular difference. The Iconoclast XLRs, as I’ve said previously, brought a quite noticeable and welcome improvement to the sound of my system for a non-Stealth level of expenditure. However, the improvement with the addition of a bi-wire set of Iconoclast speaker cables was, in my system, simply jaw-dropping. There isn’t one aspect of the sound that wasn’t greatly improved, from clarity and purity of midrange and treble, to bass power and articulation, to piano, to the sound of other and all percussion generally, to sound-source placement side-to-side and front-to-back, to, well, everything. I had no idea just how well each of the parts of my system could actually perform separately or together. The saddest part, for me, is all the years I could have been experiencing the real sound of my system—but I feel I am now.

— Chris

5572

Thank you for your thoughtful comments. Iconoclast speaker cables are particularly on my mind today because the factory called me a few hours ago with a question as they are now building my pair. May be shipped today or tomorrow. I based a decision I made on mine on a YouTube video I watched recently where Paul answers the question- does unequal length speaker cables affect the sound. His answer- probably not. My amplifier sits off to the side of my right speaker. Realistically I need a much longer run for the left side than I do the right. These SPTPC cables are pricey per foot and I can save considerably with unequal lengths. I decided to take a chance by ordering mine in 13 and 5 foot lengths. My audition pair are matched at 10 feet. My decision to buy was based on these, I hope my unmatched set will sound just as good. I’ve configured my speak setup in this dedicated listening room over a long period and I’m convinced I won’t be repositioning them in the future. These cables have improved my system substantially. I will report later on how the gamble played out.

5573

There maybe debates on SQ of different speaker cable length, but should you ever want to sell it in future it will be much harder.

5574

Bob made that clear when I proposed the idea.

5575

Chris - you get the award for the most amusingly unexpected word of the day! :joy:

5576

Good that you knew. Hopefully they’re your endgame SCs. But that’s my most often used term on my upgrades since 10 years ago.:laughing:

5577

And that’s no lie

5578

Curious how people think. Many in the program wanted to kill ICONOCLAST as the better electrical “can not be heard”, and this comment without listening to them. I invited any and everyone to come over and do exactly that. No one would because if they DID HEAR the improvements, years of denial had to be erased and explained away…no one wanted to take that risk. It is easier to remain in the majority and never threaten yourself with a different answer that puts you in the minority.

Belden believes in the electrical, yes, and why I can even build them. They have to be scientifically correct! How good cable has to be to be a benefit in most minds stops at zip cord. It was felt that selling a cable(s) this good didn’t benefit anyone. Well, I sure noticed and is why it is sold separate even from Blue Jeans as a new brand. When users are floored at what a cable does, they are just experiencing what I did developing them. And yes, it is so good you feel cheated not having them years ago!

To those who do take the time to free trial them, my hat is off for your bravery to be in a smaller and less “safe” group. A group that also has a far better sounding stereo I might add. I was hesitant to report my findings because it put me in a VERY small group in engineering! A junior engineer once said in a meeting, she could not be transferred to sales or marketing because good engineers can’t lie. Well, she’s right.

Best, Galen

5579

I received my custom made asymmetrical silver coated Iconoclast speaker cables this weekend. I had them made in 5 and 13 foot lengths to accommodate my room layout where the amp sits off to one side on the floor near the equipment rack. Got to admit I was just a bit worried about any sonic changes this might make. All is good though. I can detect nothing amiss. In fact these ended up elevating the experience to the level where I can say- “I’m done”, at least for the foreseeable future. I’m a big fan of NCAA basketball this time of the year but I just couldn’t turn off my system. Ended up recording all the games and listened to all those gorgeous sounds pouring out instead.

5580

We can foget the basic issue with analog. The load the amplifier sees isn’t a resistor. Speaker’s that are mostly resistive (not too many) will be less influenced by the speaker cable and very reactive speaker loads more so. Amplifiers are tested in steady state resistive conditions and with a consistent cable load for some degree of repeatability. Thers is no reactive load test that is used. We don’t even know what that would be. The resistive vector of the load across frequency will widely change how much any cable alters what we hear, and if it is 100% resistive we will hear the least changes. What we will hear is more the amplifier’s best performance. Amplifiers are all oscillators made wrong is the joke. Put the wrong reactive load on them and they will have troubles.

This is why ICONOCLAST makes sure the reactive load values are as low as possible while improving the input impedance, loop DCR and Vp linearity properties. These are real issues and more so depending on how reactive your speaker is. We don’t want to make the load much worse. All amplifiers hate reactance. We make oscillators using reactance. Just saying.

Best, Galen

5581

Yesterday I put the newly released Schiit Eitr 2 DDC (which converts USB to spdif via RCA, XLR, and toslink) in between my raspberry pi (w/Volumio) and DAC. I connected both Iconoclast BAV spdif RCA ( Belden 4694P) and BAV XLR and fired up a few high res tracks. With Michael Jackson’s Billie Jean the two cables were very close in soundstaging and dynamics but the XLR seemed to separate the vocals a little bit better and dynamics hit just a little harder. I got the same impression from Fleetwood Mac’s Rumours album. Fascinating!

5582

I know this is a rehash of what I’ve said before, so I apologize in advance for my reiteration.

The XLR interconnects in my system made an obvious improvement in bass impact and timbre, overall significant lowering of noise floor, particularly in midrange and treble, transient extension, and separation of sound sources. I didn’t have to close my eyes and squint my ears to hear it.

After I swapped in my bi-wired set of Iconoclast speaker cables, though, I’m sure my eyes goggled and my mouth gaped. Iconoclast’s Bob Howard just said, “I told you so!”

And it’s not just me. My audio buddy finally came over to listen to my system again and to play his favorite music. He listened to his stuff for 2.5 hours until he had to leave to get to a dinner reservation with his wife. His very first comments were about piano (my feelings, too) and bass impacts vibrating his feet through the floor. He texted me later with music he wants to hear the next time. He should hear violin—wow.

The stuff I replaced was made with copper conductors, too—beefy ones. The electrical characteristics of the cables are what changed.

— Chris

5583

And to also repeat, this is why we are here! It does make a difference. So glad you can enjoy the “secrets"of ICONOCLAST. The white papers are not as telling as what happens using them.

Best, Galen

5584

A HEADS UP! - COMING SOON - INEVITABLE PRICE INCREASE

I learned yesterday that for perhaps only the 2nd time in our 8-years with Blue Jeans Cable, we will have an across the board price increase on most Iconoclast/BAV products.

Rest assured that Galen tested many of not all “highly regarded” connection designs and options before specifying what would ultimately be on the end of our products. Performance, not price was always the deciding factor resulting in him finalizing on top of the line Cardas, Neutrik and custom made connectors on all Iconoclast and BAV products.

The Cardas SRCA SS connector used on both Gen I and II single ended cables regardless of copper conductor variant is street priced at $100 each ($400 for a single pair of cables.) This is an absolutely incredible connector and includes a retention adjustment feature. If you can find them for less, please send me a link.

Today, you could order a 5’ stereo pair of Gen I RCA cables in TPC copper for $380 or a 5’ pair of Gen II RCA cables in TPC copper for $555. The 4-connectors that sell for $400 retail, the cable cord, labor to terminate, testing and shipping are all included. This is just one example of why we are in need of an increase. Oh, and Cardas, just more than doubled our connector cost on the SRCA SS.

CRSRCASS_1-Large__75387.1691423539
CRSRCASS_1-Large__75387.16914235391132×1132 191 KB

It would be easy though time consuming to go down the list of cost increases we’ve experienced over the last year and that have accelerated over the last few months. Labor costs in Seattle are crazy high and tariffs have come into play.

Kurt gave me an hour yesterday on the phone to go through the list and discuss our options. We have a workable plan to fine tune. I’ve learned that Kurt has used basically the same pricing matrix on Iconoclast as he has done for 20+ years on BJC products.

Though not inexpensive, it’s easy to see that Iconoclast and BAV products are and will continue to be a tremendous value when compared to the competition. The sonic improvements provided by Galen’s designed/Belden USA produced and BJC cut to length, terminated, tested and shipped have to be one of the best values in the industry!

I ask that anyone on the fence or considering Iconoclast purchases in the near future contact me to lock in prices within the next couple of weeks.

Axpona is at hand and we hope to see many of our friends and customers in Chicago. You might ask Kurt or Galen about any show specials when visiting. We will be in booth/space EX9305 near the south end of the Expo hall. Treehaus Audio will again exhibit with a full loom of Iconoclast cables and power cords is in room 1422 on the 14th floor. Rich would love to say hello and you can enjoy hearing a truly remarkable audio system.

We wish everyone a very Happy Easter with friends and family.

God Bless!

Bob

5585

See you at AXPONA, and I hope, hope, hope my ear ache is better by then. Yep, I woke up with a left ear ache. All they can figure is the glue and stuff the dentist used for my upper rear molar cap got up my estacian tube, as it was all done on the left side, and gave me an inner ear issue. Red ear drum and cloudy fluid. Taking the usual anti-biotics twice a day. I can’t remember ever having an ear ache since being like 5 years old with tonsilitis. But right at AXPONA. Great. This hurts like crazy and is EARRITATING (my spelling) for sure. Maybe that’s where the word came from. Down to a 6 of 10 right now once I’m up. Once the meds kick-in I hope to be audibly servicable. Good grief.

Best, Galen

PS- Saw your cat! A beauty. Here’s mine;

20260210_094014
20260210_0940141920×1080 331 KB

5586

Yikes! Good luck, Galen. Hopefully the flight into Chicago won’t aggravate it.