@wijber - not a negative attack, just an opinion. You have one, Paul has one… we all have them. Every system is different. When asked a question about preference or weather I like or dislike, I offer my opinion. My opinion is I don’t like usb… that’s all… not personal… 
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I’m a fan of Bridge II from start due to the price/space/performance ratio.
In my case all network and NAS (the server software Jriver in my case is playing on the NAS, not on an add. PC) is on a separate power circuit and I use a galvanic isolator for the LAN connection to the bridge. And I play aif files, no flac files.
Even when I initially compared the non galvanically isolated Bridge with a simple USB connection from PC, the Bridge was clearly better. But sophisticated USB connections will surely also be much better than what I tried at the time.
When comparing Bridge with USB and DMP, it’s important not to compare one of them on a lower level of measures taken, otherwise its apples to oranges. So far I didn’t hear of anyone comparing e.g. the DMP with a more sophisticated Bridge setup. Most had simple Bridge setups (unisolated with network components on the audio circuit) or were comparing compressed flac to uncompressed PCM over DMP.
I’m still convinced Bridge II and later III will have the best price/performance ratio by far when the above mentioned care is taken, as I guess a big part of the isolation care taken inside a DMP or Octave server can be addressed by the above mentioned measures.
The perception that no one around PSAudio’s main contributors seems to use the Bridge and that there’s probably a certain interest in selling the more expensive alternatives, gives the Bridge not the attention that other components get, so I fully understand your initial thread topic, but imo it’s a sleeper.
For me Bridge was one of the main reasons to buy the whole unit.
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Could you please explain in detail, and layman terms, what a sophisticated Bridge setup looks like?
Thanks
I like the Bridge II.
There might me more options, but basically I understand the three main measures as “sophisticated” Bridge setup, which I already mentioned briefly:
Measure 1:
Running a separate mains circuit for the stereo setup, so that the rest of the house electricity including router, network switches, NAS drive, PC etc. runs isolated. This means some effort by your house electrician.
Side note (as I understand it): To achieve this isolation of the library processing unit from audio relevant electronics, e.g. the upcoming Octave server among others has to inherit costly technology to achieve this kind of power supply isolation inside the unit.
Measure 2:
Use a galvanic plug in isolation device between LAN cable and Bridge.
Side note: the upcoming Octave server to my understanding will inherit also galvanic isolation technology to avoid noise from LAN connection.
Measure 3:
For a proper comparison with e.g. the DMP, play .aif or .wav files also to the Bridge from your library. Reason is: the DMP also reads such formats from physical discs and not compressed formats like .flac, which need additional processing power of involved hardware and therefore compromises sound (so a theory and experience of some). There are different opinions on this and Ted points out that depending on care taken when comparing, various impacts could lead to differences so he sees this critically as you can read here https://forum.psaudio.com/t/firmware-versions-and-digital-sources/4630/14
IMO it’s easy to try if in your setup there’s a difference, so you can judge yourself. I tried it after an early recommendation of Paul shortly after I bought the DS, heard the difference and sticked to it.
As I see it the remaining main sound quality differences between the various options Bridge, DMP, Music server come from the actual digital lens technology (rather than the varying concept of streaming or physical disc). The latest technology usually wins over the previous. Currently Bridge II is the oldest.
I forgot to add measure 4 for a proper comparison:
Use a good sounding library SW (e.g Jriver instead of Roon)
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Bridge II is superb.
USB is well known as being the worst digital audio interface in general on any DAC. Folks are using countless bandaids on USB from special USB cables to other bridge devices that take USB and convert to I2S, Schiit Eitr etc.
I would recommend
- Bridge II or
- Optical
as the best inputs for audio sound quality. Galvanic isolation on the input is important as ground loops are extremely common and if you are lucky and don’t have one then chances are that one will develop over time.
Always and only use XLR so as to avoid ground loops to equipment on the output.
Those with noise problems obviously have set up or equipment issues.
USB is like RCA - a cheap inadequate interface for high quality or professional applications - this is why it needs so many band aids to work.
“If” you are lucky enough to get USB working well then of course it can sound as good as any input can.
I love the Bridge II. I use it with Roon/Tidal, and the mcontrol/connect app for VTuner. Other than the occasional album art “miss”, it works and sounds great!
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Bridge II is very, very good. I use a minimalist system: Synology DS412+ running MinimServer > Bridge II controlled by BubbleUPnP app on an Android tablet. The ethernet link to bridge II is isolated by a fibre optic run before converting to wired ethernet immediately upstream of the bridge.
However, given the posts on the PS forum regarding improvements in the digital lens technology and the electronic noise inherent in the current bridge installation, I’m seriously looking at replacing it with a stand-alone renderer (ethernet-to-I2S), given also that the Octave hardware (I’m not bothered about the software) is unlikely to appear before 2020.
I read of the newly marketed products claimed to sound better due to updated lenses, but I didn’t read of Bridge II having explicit noise problems or sounding worse than third party renderers…rather the opposite…and as I tried to mention before …it depends what exactly you compare in terms of care taken for each installation.
Maybe it’s better to wait for the next Bridge update in case you also see other advantages in this integrated solution (as I do, like less expenses for adequate various cabling).
I think people bother too much as soon as they read of updated developments.
Here’s what PS Audio says on the website about the Bridge II — “The new PS Audio Bridge II makes high-end fun again and connects DirectStream or PerfectWave DACs over the home network. This is the best sounding music input on a PS Audio DAC, better than even USB. Bridge II offers gapless play, stable performance, lower jitter and the freedom to enjoy digital audio collections, either PCM or DSD, with high performance at the touch of a finger.”
Except is not better than USB…
In your setup. Agreed.
USB however is usually regarded as the more troublesome or dodgy of DAC inputs (in general with most DACs)…hence all the cables, bridges etc.
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I think the network option has just as many potential “cables, bridges, etc” tweaks as any other option.
Yep - I think it mostly depends on your gear, your needs and how much effort you want to expend on a given method. And if you are willing to accept limitations of various ways of doing it.
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For me it seems to come down to software options instead of usb vs Ethernet. I much prefer Roon with HQPLAYER than Roon by itself. HQP doesn’t work with the Bridge. I even prefer the sound of Amarra 4 Luxe to Roon, even though Amarra is buggy and is not bridge compatible.
I keep coming back to USB for reasons other than its technical inferiorities.
Absolutely! I use it with Roon on a nucleus and it sounds great. Much bette than usb.
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I believe DS Snr + Bridge II + Roon is the best choice at the moment. There might be better combination of solution in the future but in terms of cost, sound quality and simplicity it is the right way to go.
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I have a Bridge II installed in my DS Snr, but since I haven´t found a way to make the Dirac RCS software in my PC to recognize it as a regular sound card it will stay unconnected.
I´m comfortable with USB for now.
Agreed. There is no limit to the lengths that paranoid listeners will go.
That said, it is fairly well established that USB is generally the worst choice of input for most DACs. Manufacturers like Schiit made several upgrades to USB whilst others chose to ignore the issues. Nobody with any experience in audio would deny the fact that the USB interface to DACs have been problematic to say the least.