I just purchased a pair of FR-30’s for a stereo only system. My drywall on studs and insulated room is 14 x 20 x 9ft. and has a carpeted, high-density pad on a concrete slab. The speaker placement will initially be 7-7.5 ft. apart and 3-3.5 ft. from the side walls and 3-4ft from the back wall measured to the rear of the speakers. The listening position will be 8-10 ft. from the front of the speakers, all close to PS Audio recommendations.
I have 2 new SVS 17 Ultra subs. I now see you are working on subs, too, but I have yet to see your placement ideas. I am more a fan of DBA (double bass array) than stacked to better deal with room modes. Currently I plan to put one sub, on a 2 ft. high ASC Subtrap stand, in-between the speakers to better match the FR-30 driver positions horizontally and vertically using a mono preamp output via XLR cable. The other mono sub I plan to put on the back wall on the floor with the phase inverted on the sub switch and if possible, add a 10-20 ms delay which I think will help to cancel 20 ft. back wall reflections back to the sitting position and reduce room mode problems.
What crossover (low pass filter) setting do you recommend starting with for the FR-30’s as the SVS Ultra subs have a very good, nearly flat response in the mono area from 15 - 80 hz? Also do you have any other ideas on this approach? I plan to put absorption panels at the 1st wall and ceiling reflection points, and diffuse/slight absorb combo on the back wall. Thanks. @Chris_Brunhaver
As a follow-up question, my preamp has an active crossover capability for low and high pass filters and various slopes. Should I let the FR-30’s roll off naturally with a full range signal and only use the low pass filter for the subs? Or would there be an advantage of turning on the high pass filter for the FR-30’s, so they do not have to deal with some of the lower bass frequencies? These filters can be set independently and do not have to both be at the same XO point if there is a benefit.
I just did a lot of experimenting with subs with my FR20’s. I had 2 SVS SB3000 subs and an older infinity sub that I connected, at different times with my FR20’s.
I noticed that my Infinity sub sounded better than the SVS in my system, that multiple outputs from my preamps affected the sound in a negative way with the SVS subs. The downside of the Infinity sub was the crossover box between the pre and power amps that had a negative effect on the sound of the FR20’s. I first had the active crossover in the signal path, then noticed an improvement in clarity with the FR20’s when connected with the box still in the system but without the active crossover.
I still ended up getting a REL carbon special sub that connects to the amplifier outputs instead of preamp outputs, and had a wonderful increase in clarity that allows my FR20’s to sound their best.
Aloha - I have a pair of FR20 heading my way. . . and have a pair of REL Carbon Specials currently paired with my Larsen model 9s. Glad to hear you had luck mating up the FR20 with the Carbon Special - looking forward to see if I like the FR20 in my room better than the Larsens.
Hi @thad! I’ve always been intrigued by the Larsen speakers. How do you like them, and what about them (if anything) contributed to your moving to the FR20s?
I love the Larsen’s sound. Not yet convinced I will like the FR20 better - time will tell. One of my most memorable audio moments was when I heard a Magnapan Tympani system driven by ARC tube electronics back in the 90s. The expansive and large sound-field is what stood out. The larsen’s do this to a good degree. I am hoping I will get increased presence and transparency with the FR20 and, perhaps more precise imaging and realism. But. . . as I said - we will see if I like the sound better than the Larsens!
That all sounds great. Thanks for investing in FR30’s. I hope you really enjoy them.
Let me know if you need more help measuring the delay for your double bass array setup.
There is a lot of output and low distortion down low on the FR30 (115 dB peak per speaker) and so there is no need to highpass them unless you’re playing organ tracks or something with sub 25 Hz bass at very high level. In general, having more low frequency sources (including large full-range tower speakers) gives smoother in-room response.
Thanks for the advice. If I let the FR-30’s roll off, It seems like i should set the subs low pass filter around 30 to 40hz. Is this range close to what you are doing with the 12 inch sub you are designing? Yes, I would like help calculating the correct delay to do the best wave cancelations for the rear sub.
In our listening room at work, there is a room mode that causes a dip around 45 hz, based on the width of the room. We placed the sub in a location where it doesn’t excite this mode and fills in that dip but the crossover point is higher, about 60 hz. Sometimes a broader overlap can advantageous to get the best results.
Having a low distortion sub is important if you’re going to place a subwoofer out of the stereo listening field and try to use a higher crossover point as any noticeable harmonic distortion (which are higher frequencies) or mechanical noise can cause issues with localizing the sub and not hearing it come from the main speakers. So, YMMV, but I would start with a higher frequency (like 60-80 hz) and do acoustic measurements and tweak from there.
If you’re happy with the upper bass and just want to add some ultra deep extension and output, a very low crossover can work
Slightly off topic but does anyone know the spade size FR30s will accept. I don’t anticipate problems but thought I’d check. My cables have 7mm spades.
Looks like there is an unanswered question in this thread. I am presently just using raw copper wire speaker ends treated w a little bit of contact enhancer from the DeoxIT family of products.
I am gonna assume that the drawback of using loose wires is that with time, the clamping pressure diminishes and the wires loosen with time at the speaker terminals.
Is the favored spade a “gold plated” copper spade ? Silver plated spade…..or are most here using raw copper wire strands……
I don’t recall if there is a consensus on what is generally better, bare wire or spades.
I do remember reading on more than one occaision that, generally speaking, a good quality set of spade connectors are “better” than banana plugs.
You got me thinking so, FYI, here is what the Chrome AI “Query Master” had to say about the subject:
"For most home audio applications, the best connectors for signal transfer and a secure connection are high-quality, gold-plated banana plugs or spade connectors. Both are superior to using bare wire, as they prevent corrosion and ensure consistent contact.
Key differences between connectors
Feature
Banana Plugs
Spade Connectors
Connection Security
The spring-loaded pin provides a snug, reliable fit and is more resistant to accidental disconnection than bare wire. High-quality plugs offer a more secure and consistent connection.
When properly tightened, a spade connector creates a very secure, low-resistance connection with a large contact surface area. This makes them highly resistant to vibration.
Convenience
Banana plugs offer a “plug-and-play” experience, making it very easy to connect and disconnect speakers. This is ideal if you frequently rearrange your equipment or have hard-to-reach terminals.
Spades are not as quick to change as banana plugs, since they require you to loosen and tighten the terminal binding post.
Installation
Installation requires securing the speaker cable to the plug itself, which can be done with screws or by soldering.
Similar to banana plugs, spades require securing the wire to the connector.
Material
A gold-plated plug, whether banana or spade, resists corrosion and oxidation, which can cause signal degradation over time.
A gold-plated plug, whether banana or spade, resists corrosion and oxidation, which can cause signal degradation over time.
Why connectors are better than bare wire
Corrosion prevention: Exposed copper wire oxidizes when it comes into contact with air, which increases resistance and degrades sound quality. A sealed connector prevents this exposure.
Safety: Loose, stray strands of bare wire can touch other terminals, causing a short circuit that can damage your amplifier. A connector neatly contains all the wire strands.
Convenience and reliability: Connectors ensure a solid, full-contact connection every time, whereas bare wire can loosen or pull out over time."
