P20 AC Power - value in the P20 over the P15? 20A power cord?

Hi charlie. Great info - thanks for sharing!
What type of conditioners have you used in the past? Cheers! Sully

tj-sully,

Iā€™ve used the PS Audio Dectet and a Furman PL-Pro C 20 A.

I should add that I did have a dedicated 20 A line installed for the P20, and I purchased a 20 A power cord for the P20 ($20 from Amazon). Now I have everything plugged into the P20, including the TV.

Charlie

thanks charliehatch. I also had a 20a circuit installed by an electrician, and is only servicing my Bryston BIT20 via Brystonā€™s stock 20a IEC cable
my next move on the power front will be upgrading the stock 20a cableā€¦are you considering upgrading your cable into your cadillac power plant? :slight_smile:

iā€™m not yet convinced a power plant will significantly improve the sound compared to the BIT20. when i first hooked up the BIT20 last year, my observations were similar, in general terms, to your description with the P20. a profound change for the better, with more space between the instruments. it almost seemed as if the music SLOWED down. but may be attributed to less noise and darker backgrounds.

itā€™s interesting that the sine wave in your test was not a sharp or ā€œfatā€ clip from the top and bottom of the waveā€¦but a more gentle effect. perhaps this may be attributed to your distance to the transformer pole, with only a few houses between you and the pole.

in my case, the electicity is generated from a hydro dam facility about 12 kmā€™s up river. from there it is transmitted at high voltage to the sub station less than 1 mile away. there are very few small industrial users between the substation and the hydro generating station. the heavy users, in the industrial park, are another 10 kmā€™s down stream.

maybe iā€™,m reading too much into this, but iā€™m having a hard time rationalizing how the power supply could be deteriorated to such an extent, given the circumstances of the electrical grid feeding my house.

given all this, a power plant may correct small deviations in the AC but the question i suppose we all must answer to ourselves isā€¦is it worth it? :slight_smile:

measurements, in this instance, may actually help the decision making process.
or maybe Paulā€¦the buy it and try it philosophy could be extended to all North American customers. :sunglasses:

Go Canucks!

T

For a different perspective on ac conditioningā€¦try a Akiko Audio Corelli ac conditioner plugged into any passive line conditioner,quality power strip or the ac outlet feeding your system. I was skeptical at first and went ahead and purchased one. What it does to lower the noise floor in my system has to be heard to be believed. A wonderful addition that will remain indefinitely in my setup.

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tj-sully,

On the power cord side, I canā€™t see spending a lot of money on a cord upstream of the P20 because the P20 kind of resets things with its output.

Your hydro power situation is interesting, but I think that some power corruption happens because of ordinary households. If you can get your hands on an oscilloscope, it would be interesting to look at the incoming power waveform and see how it looks. That could tell you something.

The other side of this issue is the impedance of the power system delivering power to your house. All those connections produce resistance that adds up. I suspect that inductance is also a player. The end result is that your power canā€™t respond quickly and the voltage may sag in response to sudden demands from your equipment. I think the big difference I hear in dynamic range in my system is due to this impedance issue. That 5 milliohm output impedance of the P20 means that power will be delivered fast, with minimal voltage sag.

This is my thinking based on what Iā€™ve read (and a little engineering background), so anyone feel free to chime in and correct me.

Bottom line is your question: Is it worth it? That depends on how much $10k is of value to you; I can say that the improvement is there.

Charlie

Thanks, Charlie. Your experience is much appreciated. We hear this over and over - the surprise and delight that people experience when they think their power is likely pretty perfect and a P20 might add a bit of improvement - only to be shocked at just how
much it changes! Truth is, even if you lived next door to a power generating station you would still hear major benefits if for no other reason than making up for the resistance in the copper wires connecting the home and system.

Thanks for helping us get the word out.

It seems this is the place to adress the issue of power cord from wall to the P20. I have a dedicated outlet, wired with 12g Romex to a 20 amp breaker. There are plenty of cords available that have a 20A end to plug into the back of the P20, but all that Iā€™ve seen have the typical American 3-prong for plugging into the wall. I thought I might change out the duplex wall outlet to a single access. The standard American 3-prong I found is rated at 20A and 125V. There is a 20A-250V style outlet that has the pattern seen when used for, say, clothers dryers (I wired my house when building it, so I know a littleā€“but only a littleā€“of this). I can find no audio cables that offer this kind of male end for this type of outlet. So, my question: Do I need the higher 250V outlet to get the full power of the P20, or will the lower 125V outlet suffice. Iā€™m driving BHK 300 monos or my Quicksilver V4 monos (KT120 tubes) and all my upstream componentā€“everything, that isā€“into the P20. Thanks for any help or suggestions!

The regular kind is fine. If you want to go better quality buy one of our Power Ports https://www.psaudio.com/products/power-port-classic/ and this is already 20 amp approved.

Thanks for your kind response, Paul. My sleep refreshed brain thought that this might have been a dumb question, as I could take a hint from the make-up of all the available 20A cables. I do in fact have a Power Port thereā€“so Iā€™m good to go!

You are indeed!

heyya Paul,
Love all your advice and philosophyā€¦but the above quote perhaps is coming from a place a little too close to the punch bowl :slight_smile:

As suggested in a post above Iā€™m embarking on a mission to measure the sine wave, and have made arrangements to have an electrical instrumentation technologist visit my house and (hopefully) measure the sine wave in my current system with the BIT20. Hopefully will gather some data and get a sense of the need, or scale of the issue, for regulation.

I believe the BIT20 is handling the impedance and peak currents fairly well. Could be better, probably - but within the range of making ā€œgood soundā€. In my mind anyway.

Iā€™ll keep you posted on any findings!

Love this hobby :slight_smile:

Sully

Ummm, well, while I am sure the Bryston is a fine unit it is, after all, only an isolation transformer. As such it has zero capabilities to fix the sine wave nor can it regulate the voltage.

To do those things you need an active regenerator. Thereā€™s just no getting around it.

I am sure it provides some benefits to you but letā€™s not imagine that those include what a Power Plant does.

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Agree with you 100%.
My only nudge was around the all encompassing quote above.

It could be viewed asā€¦if you donā€™t have a power plant, you wonā€™t have good sound. And thats just not a fair statement in my view. Thats all.

That is totally right and please accept my exuberant over exaggerated reply with a grain of salt. I apologize for my blanket statements as I donā€™t mean to offend.

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Absolutely. Thanks Paul. :slight_smile:

Hi,

Where have you found a power cable with the typical 3-prong N. American plug to an IEC C19? I canā€™t find one. Iā€™ve got a 20-amp circuit Iā€™d like to use for the P-20, but Iā€™m having a difficult time finding a cable to run from there (via Power Port) to the device.

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You should be able to make your own or have an electrician do it for you using off the shelf parts. It may not be ā€œaudiophile gradeā€ but will work fine.

Of course. But it is one available for purchase?

I use this and an AC5. Works great. Used electrical tape to keep it together. On the technical side, the AC5 is made with #10 conductor which is good for 30 amps.

Adapter