USB cables that work, or don't, with DS

I’m use a USB cable Biss 5.0 m (biss is a canadian compagnie from Laval quebec)

For the bitperfect test i’m not sure i’m ok

I download from Psaudio, three test , wav, flac, aiff

With AIFF the test is OK

With Wav and Flac i dont have a Bitperfect test ??

I’m ok or not ?

Must have bitperfect with three test (wav, flac, aiff )or just one that’s ok ?

OUPSSS

I’m use PC with window 7

AIFF TEST BITPERFECT IS OK

FLAC NO MARK BITPERFECT ON THE SCREEN

It’s good that you have at least one bitperfect result - that means that your OS isn’t interfering with the data.

On the other hand the fact that some other source file formats fail means that either you are using a different player for them and that that player isn’t configured for bit perfect playback or that the player you are using for all three formats does different processing for different input formats - something I’ve not seen before.

Dear all in PSA,

I am totally disappointed and confused from this discussion in this thread about USB cables. I have DS DAC for 6000 USD and the USB Silnote Poseidon cable for another 600 USD. Is anybody in PSA able to explain me, why this combination does not work together??? Pops are occuring.

I am using Lenovo 190 PC + Foobar + Synology 214 Play. Bit perfect test was OK. So why is the USB cable suffering by pops???

Is it a case of bad USB driver or DAC firmware??? Who and when will repair it???

One is afraid to order another, not cheap USB cable, because does not know, what will happened???

Please, explain clearly, where is the problem???

Milan

You might also not have big enough buffers in your player etc.: that can cause pops…

But assuming it’s USB related:

Is the cable USB certified? Does a USB certified cable work? If the answers are No and Yes respectively then you have your answer.

With everyone following the specs chances are good that everything is interchangeable and fairly reliable, but even then we know how many times just getting the drivers installed fails - at least it’s much better than, say, Win98…

With cables that are even 6 inches longer than the spec calls for some people will have problems and others not.

With cables that do special things with the VBUS line all bets are off - different HUBs, OS versions, and device USB implementations may or may not work. The VBUS line is used for more that just possibly powering a downstream device - for example the voltage drop rates when something is plugged in tell hubs about the device that was just plugged in.

The first step in debugging a USB problem is trying a certified cable - they are around $5 to $20 at Radio Shack, Office Depot, etc.

Ted,

I have sent the request to Silnote. The cable is 1 m long and this is from their pages:

The Poseidon Silver Statement USB features surgical high grade ultra-pure solid silver conductors in a triple shielded design. The ground conductors are completely isolated from the data conductors for the highest and purest signal transfer. Speed, detail, transparency, and a natural tonal quality is presented from a total black back ground. State of the art USB design in all aspects.

So I expect, that for 600 USD they will be USB compatible.

Milan

Still try a cheap cable and see what happens… Quality of materials is secondary to meeting the USB specs. The USB specs are designed so that very cheap materials will function well - they are about length, differential impedance, voltage drop, termination, etc. and many “audiophile” cables don’t pay enough attention to those specs.

I don’t hope you take it badly, but my experience is the more audiophile a cable is the more 'non-standard it usually is.

A stock cable for $10 always work.

Descriptions related to conformance to standards seldom works, but most fluffy selling statements do.

I think that there are many cable manufacturers out there that don’t even know how to conform and couldn’t care less.

I don’t know this manufacturer, but do yourself a favor and not take for granted that it conforms to the USB standard just because of its price tag.

Edit:

I see Ted beat me to it :)

For normal “Office supply store” cables the Belkin Gold USB cables are supposed to be very good. Maybe not “Audiophile” cables, but high quality cables that do meet the USB standards and have a good reputation in the audio community. I do not have one yet, but I intend to buy one to keep in my cable stash for reference and testing when issues like this arise.

J.P.

That is a good choice - I used to look down on Belkin but they really “get” USB and have been making good solid USB products.

I have one, quite good actually, Steve at Emperical A. has recommended it in the past as the best low cost cable.

Hello all,

upon your advice, I have pluged in the common, 5 USD cable and it works. Without any pops. But the quality of the sound is not OK. Without trebles, basses, dynamics and transparency, which Silnote had.

Could somebody place here and recap the list of cables which are 100% proven and working? Without pops? To avoid any further expensive experiments? Fortunetely my vendor of the Silnote cable will také it back.

The name of the thread is: The list of USB cables working with DS, isnt it? I cannot see any list here. Now it is a detective story to obtain and extract relevant info from this forum.

Thanky you very much.

Milan

I don’t know anyone that’s had problems with the JCat line of cables. Also USB cables from bigger companies like AudioQuest are likely to work since they can’t deal with gobs of returns.

I think if you read from the top to the bottom there are some other cables that are universally praised.

Another thing that might be worth trying is to put an externally powered hub near the DS with a shorter USB cable (say a meter or two) and then possibly getting a linear power supply for the hub, that will isolate you from the worst of the interference from either your source computer or a longer cable. There are some audiophile style cables that have this built in, but I don’t know their names off of the top of my head nor have I personally used them.

Milan, the Wireworld Silver Starlight works. As Ted indicated as well there are good reports for JCat and Audioquest.

Also keep in mind that a cable that works well with one digital source may not with another. It is always best to buy from a vendor that accepts returns if it all possible. I use a moderately priced Kimber silver USB cable with good results but have not compared it to other, more expensive cables. Also, once Bridge 2 comes out I may be using that more than my USB connection so didn’t want to spend a fortune on a USB cable.

Hello all,

this is the info about my correspondece with Silnote. My question to tem was: is your cable Poseidon USB standard certified? The answer was:

Milan

You are welcome. It is probably just a compatibility issue with the PS
audio gear. We have heard of this from other cable manufactures as
well. We have not had any problems with the Poseidon USB however.
Thank you.

Regards
Mark
Silnote Audio

So where is the true now??? confused

Milan

I think it is very vague (to put it mildly) to not state which USB standard it complies with. I guess this says it all…

If I am not much mistaken the DS uses a standard, certified COTS component on the USB side.

Dear all,

I gave my Silnote USB cable to my friend, who has PWD MKII unit. At him it plays OK without any pops.

You know, I dont have as much time to run though all threads here. Can anybody again explaun to me, why with PCM unit it works nad with DS not? It must be a SW problem! USB driver or ASIO, so what??

Thank you for your reply.

Milan

Briefly if it’s not a certified USB cable you can’t expect it to work with arbitrary certified USB peripherals. That’s the purpose of certification - to verify that it will work with other certified devices. Small examples: if it is just a little too long it may work one day and not the next (temperature variations), it may work with one OS, but not another, it may work with one kind of hub, but not another…

In particular many “audiophile” cables don’t hook up the power connection of the USB cable. The power connection is not only used to provide power to otherwise unpowered hubs or devices, but it’s also used in the protocol to tell what kind of device is pugged in. If it’s not connected the cable may work with one OS, but not another, it may work with one kind of hub, but not another, it may…

Bottom line, there’s something wrong with a USB device if it doesn’t work with ALL other CERTIFIED USB devices. In this case it’s something is wrong with your cable.

If you suspect that it’s not your cable, then replace your cable with a certified cable and see if things work. If so it’s your cable, if not perhaps something else is wrong.

If this doesn’t make sense please read the other messages that may have more detail.

[Edit: I see that it was you who asked this question just a few messages above. I’m not sure how else to say it.]

I think the biggest problem here is that an expensive procurement has to be justified. I have no problem understanding the disappointment when the newly arrived cable does not work. I would also be looking for the guilty (and maybe punish the innocent along the road) :wink: