Another bridge issue


#1

Hi Dennis,

Great that u could reproduce the bridge freezing issue.

Here I wud like to bring in your notice another similar issue.

After I run the ds with bridge continuously (the ds with bridge as input is power switched on continuously but i may not be playing songs from controller continuously) in every 2-3 days the bridge becomes inaccessible from the controller. The ds works as I can change the input to something else but bridge remains inaccessible. Only solution is resetting the bridge either from front panel or web interface.

I have used all different type of controllers - elyrics plug player, linn kinsky on ipad mini, bubble upnp on samsung tab4. Same result.

Any idea ?

Regards,

Sourav


#2
Sourav Mazumder said Hi Dennis,

Great that u could reproduce the bridge freezing issue.

Here I wud like to bring in your notice another similar issue.

After I run the ds with bridge continuously (the ds with bridge as input is power switched on continuously but i may not be playing songs from controller continuously) in every 2-3 days the bridge becomes inaccessible from the controller. The ds works as I can change the input to something else but bridge remains inaccessible. Only solution is resetting the bridge either from front panel or web interface.

I have used all different type of controllers - elyrics plug player, linn kinsky on ipad mini, bubble upnp on samsung tab4. Same result.

Any idea ?

Regards,

Sourav


Hi Sourav…I get the occasional Bridge dropout so I have to reboot the DAC. If that doesn’t work I will reset the Bridge. 2-3 days uninterrupted operation is pretty good, though. Not knowing your setup, I really cant say if you can make it better.

#3

The Bridge is a temperamental thing. You can perhaps make it more reliable by improving your network (setting static IP addresses for your components, upgrading your router if it’s a cheap one); many folks here have taken these steps, including me. But I don’t get 100% perfect performance. In my situation I find that restarting the control app after the Bridge drops the connection, or occasionally resetting the UPNP server from the Bridge web page, do the trick; rebooting the DAC is rare for me. You just have to experiment and see what works for you. And don’t expect consistency. I’ve been playing for 3-4 days now with no hiccups, but at other times have lost the connection a couple of times in one evening. Just go with the flow and practice not allowing the Bridge to disturb your enjoyment of the music. I still prefer my NAS/ethernet/Bridge setup to running a separate computer and feeding it via USB. We all eagerly await Bridge II, which should be much more robust.


#4
magister said The Bridge is a temperamental thing. You can perhaps make it more reliable by improving your network (setting static IP addresses for your components, upgrading your router if it's a cheap one); many folks here have taken these steps, including me. But I don't get 100% perfect performance. In my situation I find that restarting the control app after the Bridge drops the connection, or occasionally resetting the UPNP server from the Bridge web page, do the trick; rebooting the DAC is rare for me. You just have to experiment and see what works for you. And don't expect consistency. I've been playing for 3-4 days now with no hiccups, but at other times have lost the connection a couple of times in one evening. Just go with the flow and practice not allowing the Bridge to disturb your enjoyment of the music. I still prefer my NAS/ethernet/Bridge setup to running a separate computer and feeding it via USB. We all eagerly await Bridge II, which should be much more robust.
x2...there is a Bridge 2 in the pipeline. Rumour has it that it may be more reliable and support gapless playback. I don't really wanna pay for a new one, though.

#5

It’s funny; I’ve never had this problem with the Bridge in my PWD (and so far DS).


#6
tony22 said It's funny; I've never had this problem with the Bridge in my PWD (and so far DS).
And I have given up getting mine to work again.

#7

Secret tip…

try pushing the reset button occasionally on your modem/router from your ISP.

i could explain why, but it is, after all, a secret. Shhhhh


#8
gordon said Secret tip....

try pushing the reset button occasionally on your modem/router from your ISP.

i could explain why, but it is, after all, a secret. Shhhhh


No longer a secret103_gif

#9

Could someone please explain the difference in the addresses showing in my Bridge Network Config screen. Bridge of course is no longer playing even with a crossover cable, DS to Mini, when both were set for statics.

At the top under ‘LAN Enabled : Yes’

The IP is 192.168.249.243
and GateWay 192.168.249.1

Then under 'LAN DHCP [10.0.1.18]/Yes’
the GateWay is 10.0.1.1, which is my Apple Extreme.

Do these look ok ? And why are the Gateways so different ? I don’t recall them being that different before, everything else on my LAN is 10.0.1.X.

Gordon, your secret did not work 20_gif.


#10

Well I never had to reset the router. Every time resetting the bridge either through the front panel or web interface worked predictably and perfectly

But, I don’t buy the opinion that users may ignore this as an issue. For me (or anyone little technical) this may be ok. But think of lesser technical users (say my wife). For them it can cause major inconvenience as they cannot listen to the music the time they want - they don’t have much clue what is going on. Yes they can be taught to reset the bridge with the above mentioned ways. But eventually they may loose interest about this otherwise excellent dac because of that complex (for them) steps and start using something else which is more user friendly. So eventually DS will loose out adoption from a wider user base.

Whatever other similar streamer I have tried out (Sonos, Oppo, Pioneer Elite N30, Naim NDX) none has this problem. Probably the reason is all of them have their own dedicated app which can reset the respective upnp server transparently.

So here goes my suggestion for the solution. As soon as the DS is brought to ‘on’ status either through remote or the logo button, the reset of the bridge should be done automatically. User will see the initializing the screen. But they can wait for 1-2 minutes and after that they can predictably listen to music. IMHO it will surely bring in hell lot of predictability. The behavior is ‘whenever you switch on the DS it is ready to play music’. This anyway happens today when one does hard reboot from the switch at back of DS but as I understand that is not what is recommended to be done frequently.

Regards,

Sourav


#11

Rogerdn,

R u using DHCP ? If yes then the gateway and ip of the ds would be automatically assigned you dont need to bother.

Also all streamers will work better when you connect them to router and the NAS/Server is also connected to the same router (though mine is little more complex setup with an additional extender in between). Not sure why you are directly connecting to the MacMini.

Regards,

Sourav


#12
Sourav Mazumder said Rogerdn,

R u using DHCP ? If yes then the gateway and ip of the ds would be automatically assigned you dont need to bother.

Also all streamers will work better when you connect them to router and the NAS/Server is also connected to the same router (though mine is little more complex setup with an additional extender in between). Not sure why you are directly connecting to the MacMini.

Regards,

Sourav

The direct was just a temporary test to see if removing the router and switch would allow connection, it didn't. My router is 75 ft away and I need a switch in my music room to accommodate everything. Mini has attached storage. Current is DHCP but have had static no help.

#13
rogerdn said Could someone please explain the difference in the addresses showing in my Bridge Network Config screen. Bridge of course is no longer playing even with a crossover cable, DS to Mini, when both were set for statics.

At the top under ‘LAN Enabled : Yes’

The IP is 192.168.249.243
and GateWay 192.168.249.1

Then under 'LAN DHCP [10.0.1.18]/Yes’
the GateWay is 10.0.1.1, which is my Apple Extreme.

Do these look ok ? And why are the Gateways so different ? I don’t recall them being that different before, everything else on my LAN is 10.0.1.X.

Gordon, your secret did not work 20_gif.


I have a static Bridge ip…the gateway is the router ip. What works for me is LAN DHCP: NO

#14
rossop said
rogerdn said Could someone please explain the difference in the addresses showing in my Bridge Network Config screen. Bridge of course is no longer playing even with a crossover cable, DS to Mini, when both were set for statics.

At the top under ‘LAN Enabled : Yes’

The IP is 192.168.249.243
and GateWay 192.168.249.1

Then under 'LAN DHCP [10.0.1.18]/Yes’
the GateWay is 10.0.1.1, which is my Apple Extreme.

Do these look ok ? And why are the Gateways so different ? I don’t recall them being that different before, everything else on my LAN is 10.0.1.X.

Gordon, your secret did not work 20_gif.

I have a static Bridge ip…the gateway is the router ip. What works for me is LAN DHCP: NO


Thks but already tried that for several months.

#15

rogerdn

It looks like you have picked up an IP addy and gateway that is not from YOUR router.[AE]

The “249” is the clue. [PSA internal}

Try setting DHCP to yes, remove the two 192.xx that you noted so thay will reset.

Reboot the DAC and it should find the AE network and reset the IPs to the 10.0.xx range. [ may need to reboot the AE as well].

I suspect that the 10 IP range is coming from your modem/router and not the standard AE range.

This is ok and should work but just not as well as using a true static IP to the AE.

Most modem/routers do NOT allow a true Internal LAN IP static setting, even if it looks like it did.

Let me know if the above resets your IPS and all works ok and I can then elaborate on the M/R some more if you wish.


#16

Also check that you do not have two ‘routers/AP’ both trying to distribute and assign DHCP adresses (e.g. a router on WAN and Airport Express connected on the LAN side).

If you do, then one of them have to be set to Bridge mode.

10.x adresses is commonly used by Apple.


#17

Hmmm, how could that be ? Will try your suggestions later today, thks Gordon.


#18

Yes, as well as many cable/tel modem routers.

residential models look for one local IP and are not completely compatible with robust home LANs.

best option is to ask the provider for a “commercial” modem only model and this avoids conflicts.

often the overnight tv updates as well as firmware adjustments can throw of the internal settings of a second router, especially is static IPs are set. Best is to reserve a DHCP range and set the permanent nodes outside of it.


#19
Frode said Also check that you do not have two 'routers/AP' both trying to distribute and assign DHCP adresses (e.g. a router on WAN and Airport Express connected on the LAN side).

If you do, then one of them have to be set to Bridge mode.

10.x adresses is commonly used by Apple.


Frode, yes I do have an A Extreme at my modem 75 ft away, then an A Express in my music room for Wi Fi extension, but as I recall it’s set as a bridge, it’s been six months, how could I confirm this ? I have the Mac AirPort utility, I don’t see anything there that would tell me. Fing says A Extreme is 10.0.1.1 and Express .13. Thks for the help, I’ll try Gordon’ s later today.

#20
rogerdn said
Frode said Also check that you do not have two 'routers/AP' both trying to distribute and assign DHCP adresses (e.g. a router on WAN and Airport Express connected on the LAN side).

If you do, then one of them have to be set to Bridge mode.

10.x adresses is commonly used by Apple.

Frode, yes I do have an A Extreme at my modem 75 ft away, then an A Express in my music room for Wi Fi extension, but as I recall it's set as a bridge, it's been six months, how could I confirm this ? I have the Mac AirPort utility, I don't see anything there that would tell me. Fing says A Extreme is 10.0.1.1 and Express .13. Thks for the help, I'll try Gordon' s later today.
Airport Utility shows it.

Select Off (Bridge mode) if your other units are placed on the same subnet.

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