Here is the PDF again.
Sorry guys. Website got hosed and had to restore from an older database. Much was lost.
Finally got to see the price list … 
That’s not quite what I was expecting, certainly high end pricing, though admittedly, on the lower end of the megabuck scale. Based on what Will has said, at least these seem to have a sound basis for the high price. I’ll wait to see what the general consensus is, given that cables are so system dependant that’s too big a plunge for me (also the wallet is very thin right now …).
Paul McGowan said Sorry guys. Website got hosed and had to restore from an older database. Much was lost.Seems like a good time say thanks for providing the forum in the first place.
It’s great that PS Audio provides such a forum, many other places do not.
Any posts that are super-important will be easy enough to remember and replace.
Again, thanks.
And thanks for participating. It wouldn’t mean much if no one came, cared or read what’s written.
I will try to summarize what I had written. The TPC speaker cables are what I reviewed and shorter lengths will be available eventually but the price will not be even divisions of the 3m price due to the relatively high cost of termination. No, they are not cheap, but for the sound, these cables are a steal, IMHO. I currently have the OCC balanced interconnects in my rig but will be returning them; too expensive for me. I am anxious to audition the TPC and OFC versions and I’ll let you know what I think. If the TPC versions are anywhere close to the sound offered by the TPC speaker cables, then $610/$865 will be a great price for their level of performance. I would GUESS that their entry level cabling outperforms most of the cabling out there, regardless of price and, yes, I mean some very expensive stuff. This was a very deliberate goal of Galen’s and he recommends the OFC interconnects and the TPC speaker cables. OCC was more of an afterthought driven by others. I am working on getting a set of cables for limited audition among the PSA forum bunch. Wish me luck!
EDIT: Hanson has trouble getting these things back in their shop from loan. A good friend has my speaker cables and will not give them back. It’s been a few weeks now and I get, "Well, maybe this weekend, I just want to keep them a little longer."
He is trying to unload his Vallhallas now. He should be able to buy any combination of Iconoclast TPC/OFC cabling with the proceeds. I think that he paid almost $12k for them!! They were done in by the plain copper Beldens.
Given your account about the quality of the cable and its performance in the speaker version, it’s really great that they are doing 1m long TPC interconnects at US$865 in XLR termination, or even cheaper at US$610 in RCA termination.
I hope they can do similar lengths cables with spade / banana terminations.
I’m trialling Audioquest mid-range as well as the Analysis Plus which were burned in.
Analysis Plus do any length requested, and start their minimum length at 1m. They must build in all the margins for running the equipment and terminating the cables into that baseline price.
From the point of the initial minimum length, they are totally aligned with their customer, in that additional cable length costs a certain additional price per unit length.
Belden could take a similar approach, they would sell a lot more cable and arguably wouldn’t lose any money - unless one thinks that customers can be forced into buying 3m lengths when 1.5m is more than sufficient; and then the bean-counters are running an estimate based on % of people buying the extra length vs the # of sales lost on the more expensive product.
PS - I’m very new to this. Previously, I wondered whether cabling made much difference at all. I listened to people who said it made a massive difference, but was determined to make up my own mind, based on my ears, to the extent I could - cognitive bias, imperfect everything and all that.
Cables make a huge difference in my system !
I was going with a minimum of Gibraltar after I heard them remove the last major problem I could hear in my system in my room. I don’t mind the Kimber 8TC, and I don’t expect Gibraltar would compete with lots of other cables including these Belden’s, but it was much better and removed my immediate pain point.
Could not live with the Rocket 88, which are more expensive that the KK 8TC.
Green, I’d like to hear more about how the Gibraltars sounded in you system compared to the 8TC. Were these the blue/black or the white/clear Kimbers?
EDITED for brevity.
Hi Tony
Worked through AQ and AP and KK cables.
In simple terms, I could live with the 8TC - they didn’t do anything particularly wrong.
8TC : friendly, relaxed, competent & inoffensive.
Gibraltar : more resolving, deeper bass, sustained highs. With JC + Gibraltar + PSB’s, the music just gets louder, retaining definition - it’s doesn’t offend.
Speakers were rated Class A stereophile, but as limited extreme frequency, they roll-off well above 20 Hz. -1.5 dB at 33 Hz; -3 dB at 30 Hz; -10 dB at 24 Hz.
Interested in Revel Ultima Salon (original not 2’s). Would love to hear all comments / opinions about these, including whether they might be “past it” (these one are 2005 vintage, but the design was released in 1998). Anyone with an opinion about these speakers - positive or negative, please make it known.
AP seemed like a total revelation with music focussed on mids and highs, and resolution but they lacked bass.
I’m going to start over in the morning, methodically.
Serious lack of low-end w/ AP is a deal killer. I like a wide range of music, perhaps full-range speakers would help.
http://www.stereophile.com/how-is-ted-coding-the-fpgaent/psb-synchrony-one-loudspeaker-measurements
So, that leaves the Gibraltar as preferred. They do everything well enough, and do nothing badly.
AQ lacked the vast resolving power of AP in the higher end; hopefully more expensive cables do provide both ? Suggestions welcome.
Your experience with the Analysis Plus mirrors mine, although I am more negative than you. 
I have not heard the Revel Ultima Salons in a long time, but really liked them: very open, airy, articulate, accurate timbre, plenty of bass for me.
Thanks for passing on your recollection of the Salon’s. Age doesn’t necessarily bother me. And I’m keen on a good, (relatively) inexpensive full, range speaker.
AP is fast and detailed. Incredible detailed mids and highs (tone is a question mark).
But, couldn’t live with the lack of bass
Elk, I get the impression you didn’t like much at all about the Big Silver Oval 9’s ? How would your more negative riff go ?
Any cable suggestions that might achieve AP + Bass are very welcome.
Does the Belden Iconoclast achieve this ? And will they do Iconoclast TPC Speaker Cables the same length as the Iconoclast TPC Interconnects ?
Just kidding - this has already been answered - my wishful thinking. 
I like the theoretical concepts behind the Analysis Plus, although I am suspicious that it has nothing to do with audio frequencies.
I found the sound of these cables dreadful; thin, little bass, harsh, inaccurate. Lamp zip cord is better. Seriously.
I haven’t heard the Silver Ovals myself so I can’t compare them. The folks a Hanson AV also sell AP so they could give some insight. I have spent some time swapping cables there but was concentrating on Nordost Odin. I found the frequency balance of the Iconoclasts to be close to the Odins but would give the Odins better highs and mids. I preferred the bass of the Iconoclasts, however. The Odins have an outrageous ability to provide imaging that puts you more “there”. Almost spooky. If I wanted a pair I would have to pull a son out of college… don’t think that I haven’t thought about it!
I keep hanging out down at the crossroads at midnight, too, but so far no luck…
Well, following my comparisons, and re-reading the review of the Belden’s, I can see why @wglenn might be so excited by the Iconoclast’s.
Specifically, I ended the exercise totally confused. Mainly because my assumptions that it would be a linear progression where one just picked a price and got a certain SQ, if there was any perceived difference at all, completely broke down.
I can now imagine it only gets more confusing as one goes up the tree in price; although hopefully the good brands converge again at some point - given how many times I’ve read the goal of cables : nothing added; nothing subtracted; i.e. no Signal Processing… (and I’ve got to say I’m not sure how to practically ‘calibrate’ to whatever the “truth” might be. It would help in this regard if I played a lot of non-electric music, well - but I don’t do either).
What I found were cables that did their jobs so differently that I am shocked the industry - somewhere, somehow - hasn’t standardised measuring the output of cables in some fashion. I know, I know : what should be the base configuration and what should measured… still, seems that there would be a lot of value in some heavyweights coming together and picking an agreeable set of “neutral” equipment and then allowing this reference system to be used to review cables… Canadian ANC-style, but focussed on isolating cables as a key point of difference.
Think I’ll try and restrict funds expended and save my powder for a time when I can make better, more informed assessments.
AQ Gibraltar : better balance, better bass, less detail - particularly in voice and strings. AP - giving them up felt like a loss, particularly in resolution of male and female voices and all stringed instruments (was concerned about tonal accuracy, but it didn’t sound bad to my ear).
Now, I’m open to spending more money on getting to fast, neutral, resolution, with correct tone and balanced coverage.
Anyone used Kubala Sosna ? I can pick up ex-demo gear at serious discount, and the Kubala Sosna upgrade policy might make it a rewarding approach. Entering at Expression and perhaps upgrading to Emotion. Perhaps mixing Expression speaker with Emotion interconnects and XLR’s… ?
Also, @pmc7027, did you ever track down a well worn-in version of the AP Crystal Oval 8 ? ( was looking for reviews and came across,
PS - does anyone else think this makes a bit of a mockery of the whole minimise the distortion approach to things, when these other components totally transform the sound system-beginning to system-end ?? measuring parts per million / billion vs wholesale frequency transformation that cannot be reliably measured, except maybe in “english”, a highly highly imprecise and ill-defined means of comparison.
Very amusing find for an Analysis Plus review!
(Dave is another trumpet player. Seriously good.)
Interesting - so you guys both play Trumpet (and no doubt very well)
and you find AP to be harsh & inaccurate,
yet Dave loves his Crystal (not sure that reads well, no dependency implied !).
–
Well, I have no hope in determining any semblance of any version of the ‘truth’ !
My best guess is that the cable is highly system dependent.
It’s hard to argue with the proposition that cabling should be selected no earlier than all other components.
I’m absolutely fascinated by the idea that two good (++ ?) trumpet players feel so completely differently about the sound coming of similar systems.
Thinking about the way Kevin Voecks discussed development of the Salon / Salon2 speakers, it would be a blessing if the Harman facility (or the Canadian government facility) were directed towards determining whether people have, in total, a preference for particular types of cables, and amplifiers for that matter. ( I’ve been very interested to read on avforums.com the fervour with which posters claim no discernible difference b/w the sound of amplifiers, in some set of (i believe) uncited double blind tests. I cannot relate to this idea, but it is obviously prevalent in some quarters. )
http://www.stereophile.com/interviews/608kev/
Hopefully the Belden Iconoclast cables are a big step up, appreciated by a number of users. will be great once a few others are able to test out the Belden Iconoclast. Looking forward to seeing the reviews on here.
@wglenn, any impressions from the Belden team on how their new cables were received at AXPONA?
I don’t think he’ll mind me posting his own words here.
"The 2015 AXPONA show went well, and the line support we provide was VERY well received by show attendees. The performance of the FOCAL speakers with our ICONOCLAST™ OF speaker cables was excellent, as was the OCC RCA’s in higher end the C4 room.
Attendees loved our cable, quality and our program (choice of copper and full test reports). Never before had they seen so much real information on design… they LOVED the fact that they can compare and contrast JUST the copper to see if their system can drive the expensive copper well enough to be heard. The standard copper and OF copper choices are very well received based on performance levels the cable achieves.
David Schultz (REL sub woofer rep) who used to rep TRANSPARENT cables commented on the extreme quality of our design and materials, both. His review of the cable on the FOCAL speakers was very positive (best he’s ever heard that speaker sound with our cables). He thinks our program was well better thought out than most, and by far, for a new line in the high-end market." - Galen Gareis
