Beta testers wanted for LANRover

I swear the world hates me. I finally finished all the crap I had to get done, including a trip to the dentist, I broke a tooth lose, Saturday afternoon.

Ok, I listen for a few minutes and swap out the LANRover for a single 1.5m AQ Carbon, I sit back to listen and they start using jack hammers in front of my house.

Another thing. I had been running a 3m AQ Cinnamon cable between dac and PC [for reasons I forget] . Before I got the LANRover I put in a 1.5m Cinnamon, better. So calling my dealer I ended up trading my two lengths of Cinnamon for the Carbon, thinking that the supplied cable would be fine.

Well I need a .5m of a better quality cable. There are very few usb cables for sale on Audiogon and Asylum Marketplace, no .5m and nothing in my price range. Does anyone have a used . 5m Pangea silver or the Kimber that sells for $50 new, that they would be willing to sell? Some of you seem to have many usb cables. Apparently no one sells inexpensive used usb cables. I would be interested in . 5m or . 75m.

Quickest way to reach me is at: roadwrench3@gmail.com

The dentist really cut into my August budget.

Thank you,

Jeff

crwilli said Does anybody have the LR running with a Windows PC and JRiver into any DAC?

Does anybody have the LR running with a Macintosh PC with any software into an Esoteric DAC?


Yes Toshiba laptop, Windows 10, with JRiver 21 to Benchmark Dac2 HGC. Connections work fine. After swapping out cables I only have to hit stop as pause locks it up. I pause, change setup and then hit stop, then play. Works every time.

crwilli said Does anybody have the LR running with a Windows PC and JRiver into any DAC?

Does anybody have the LR running with a Macintosh PC with any software into an Esoteric DAC?


Yes. I have been putting off my review because of typing speed. I will finish one soon.

PC HP 520 TouchSmart 1047C and jRiver and Fidelizer. No problems with playback.

highstream said
ozzymilton said
Hold the presses...

I just couldn’t resist trying the LANRover WITH my chain.

So, with the LANRover in the chain, it seems to add some clearness to the sound. That includes to the treble and bass. I’m not sure at this early testing if it is not a little too bright, but it definitely changes the sound quality.

I know most of us will think that this is probably overkill and maybe it is. Surprisingly though, each product provides there little something to the overall sound quality.

Brightness and upper end distortion or roughness were among what I heard initially. I’m giving the unit some time. I think Paul’s and others’ comments about improvements right off suggesting burnin is not necessary are overly optimistic. Virtually everything in this world, animate and not, needs burnin, and thus far here the LANRover hasn’t been an exception. Which doesn’t mean all initial issues will necessarily be overcome. The supplied cables and power supply are certainly a variable here.


I agree with you on burnin. I started running a Purist break in file through it. Just 12 hours later and it has mellowed a little. I’ll keep giving it more time and then try it again solo.

Thanks for your reply.

After trying all combinations of setting/resetting the various configurations of the software players and MIDI, the following applies on my MacBook Pro. I also retested them all both straight to the DAC and through the Regen, and all players are functioning perfectly without the Rover pair in place.

  • Roon/HQPlayer – Works great. Best digital I have heard in my system…by far.
  • Roon – Can’t get it to work. After attempt, I need to reboot to play to DAC.
  • Audirvana – Works great. Sounds much better than Regen.
  • PureMusic – Can’t get it to work. After attempt, I need to reboot to play to DAC.
  • Amarra – Can’t get it to work. After attempt, I needed to “safe boot” and unplug/replug power to DAC. Don't want to try it again until a fix is out, as it messed with my laptop in a big way.
  • JRiver 22 - Can't get it to work. After attempt, I occasionally need to reboot to play to DAC, but not always.

Well it’s time for the review.

Let me get to the bottom line 1st, for those of you who don’t care to read through a long post.

Remember YMMV (your music may vary), this applies to my system, with my synergies, and my preferences.

  1. Does the LanRover make an audible difference?

        Yes
    
  2. Is it better than sliced bread, in other words night and day?

         Not with my system.
    
  3. Is it better than anything else used with my system?

         No
    
  4. Was there any difficulty in setting it up or making it play?

         Absolutely none!
    
  5. Are the differences large enough to justify keeping it?

         Unfortunately, no
    

Okay off to the races.

You can see from my signature below there’s a bunch of equipment in my system. About 15 months ago I moved halfway across the United States. It took some time to have a new audio room built and then several months to dial in the system that had been dialed in, in my previous audio room over an 18 year period. I finally accomplished “dialing it in” about two months ago.

My setup currently is pretty simple and straightforward as far as digital is concerned. An HP 520 touchsmart with an i5 processor and six gig of memory. It’s running Windows 10, Fidelzer and jRiver 20. The USB out goes through an audioquest jitterbug and then a Locust Design Group Polestar USB cable to the PS audio DSD directstream DAC.

In preparation for the arrival of the LanRover I pulled out my old USB to S/PDF blue box that uses a much older XMOS chip. To my surprise S/PDIF input was audibly better than USB direct. The Blue box has both coax and optical output. There was no difference in sound quality from coaxial versus optical. Therefore I chose to use optical because of the galvanic isolation.

It was with great anticipation that I waited for the arrival of the LanRover.

I’ve now listened for several days with several different configurations.

        1) USB direct with and without jitterbug versus LanRover with and without jitterbug

        2) blue box vs blue box supplied by LanRover with and without jitterbug

break-in/burn-in: out-of-the-box it was less impressive than the following day. I’ve not noticed any change over the successive days.

My DAC supplies a Behringer crossover. The same one supplied by Sanders with his hybrid electrostatics. From there everything above 127 Hz goes by way of tubes directly to large electrostatic panels. I listened in the extreme nearfield so it’s somewhat like a huge set of headphones, but without the “in the head image” problems.

The LanRover versus direct adds a slight bit more lower midrange warmth and slightly better defined image, in other words more tightly defined within the sound field. There is no noticeable difference in width, depth or height of the images. At the same time the LanRover seems to lose a bit of harmonic complexity.

The blue box by itself is much more revealing than the LanRover, especially with harmonic complexity.

Adding the LanRover to the blue box again demonstrates a very slight warming of lower midrange, but a loss in definition in both lower bass and harmonics. The best way I can describe what I’m calling the loss of harmonics is the difference between listening to a very good speaker with and without a grill cloth.

As I indicated I was quite excited about receiving the LanRover, based on Paul’s glowing report. And you will notice that there are others on this thread who have been thrilled by the differences.

Unfortunately for me my $50 USB to S/PDIF converter, purchased several years ago, easily outperforms the LanRover and the addition of the LanRover to the chain actually makes the sound less real and less involving. Remember YMMF.

I hope this review helps others. And I’m very appreciative and thankful to Paul and the crew for the opportunity to Beta test.

Bruce

darrenv1070 said I have had my Beta test LAN Rover since Friday. It was as easy to install on my Mac Mini as simple plug and play. I have Roon and ITunes with Bitperfect to compare. I also have a recently installed bridge II installed in my DS dac running Torreys final.

As far as the LAN Rover goes, it is really an amazing difference from USB even with USB filters and tweaks. I had been using the Uptone Audio REGEN as of late and started off with the Audioquest Jitterbug. Both helped a bit, but NOTHING like the LAN Rover.

The audio is immediately more open, relaxed, tons of detail, and the wide deep soundstage is amazing. Funny thing I didn’t like Torreys final vs Yale before the Lan Rover or Bridge II. But now, forget it! I am NOT going back.

I will say at least in my system, the LAN Rover is so, so close the Bridge II it’s amazing. Both super easy to use, and set up on the MAC. I

If someone didn’t want to use Roon then the Lan Rover is the way to go, also more options as to dac firmware. I have both. I can’t see myself not keeping the LAN Rover as well as the Bridge II. I may ty to use the Lan Rover to send info from PS Audio NuWave Phono Converter to my mac over the network! I’ll post results once I try it later this week or weekend.

I have the Regen up for sale! if anyone is interested. It’s good, but the Lan Rover is GREAT! The Bridge II is outstanding!!


That’s interesting. I preferred the early Beta Torrey version over the Final version.

Perhaps I need to again try the LANRover with the Torrey’s Finale. Thanks for bringing that up.

Dr. W said Well it's time for the review.

Let me get to the bottom line 1st, for those of you who don’t care to read through a long post.

Remember YMMV (your music may vary), this applies to my system, with my synergies, and my preferences.

  1. Does the LanRover make an audible difference?

        Yes
    

  1. Are the differences large enough to justify keeping it?

         Unfortunately, no
    

Okay off to the races. …

Bruce, How much burnin time did you allow?

It was continuously powered up for 5 days with 2 to 4 hours of playtime each day.

As i indicated, I heard no further change in sound after the first 12 or so hours.

Plugged in the LanRover this morning. My chain is

Upsampling MinimServer on PPC -> MPD on NUC running LibreElect-> Wyrd -> Wyred4Sound uLink Optical -> Lyngdorf -> Schiit UberFrost via coax

Since this was a working setup I slotted the LR in between the NUC and the Wyrd. More configurations will be attempted later.

Some nits:

(1) The pairing buttons should offer some tactile feedback so you can tell you’re pressing them. Or, maybe, be more distinguishable than just being a hole in the case of the LR.

(2) Several subsections in the manual share the same heading. For example, “Direct Connect via network.” There’s no way to tell which subsection is appropriate for the intended setup without reading through it.

I did not have a lot of time to listen but did not notice any degradation. First impression is that the music was a little warmer, bassy-er.

I left it burning in and will give more critical listening this evening.

Dr. W said It was continuously powered up for 5 days with 2 to 4 hours of playtime each day.

As i indicated, I heard no further change in sound after the first 12 or so hours.

Sorry I missed that. I won't claim to know how much burn in is needed for the LR, and your 12-20 hours may indeed have been enough. I'm on the patient side and don't assume the process of improvement is linear or continuously progressive. In fact, one cable company, I think Morrow, says their cables actually turn worse for awhile in the midst of the process. I don't think they are alone in that behavior.

Follow up: Over the weekend, I wrote after a few hours listening with Bug Head player that “…What’s not sounding as good with them is smoothness, coherence and sense of presence (or engagement), e.g., of an ensemble, such as Brian Bromberg’s on Wood.” At ~20 hours that incoherence was still there. I recall a Sara Bareilles live album where the piano’s bass notes were practically in my lap and she nearly backstage, while Laura Nyro at the Fillmore was both distended and screechy. Well, now at ~45-50 hours, I wound up Bug Head again. Nyro is now entirely coherent and any screechiness is attributable to the old recording and her bad cold that night, while Bareilles and the piano have largely gotten together, at least as much as the sound engineer apparently obliged. And each has developed a sense of presence in spades, as has Brian Bromberg. I suspect there’s still more to come, how much to be seen. That said, I’m not listening to your system and thus have a different point of reference.

Tuesday August 2, 2016

Just returned from vacation over the weekend and picked up my Beta Test LANRover (LR) from my local FedEx Office store today.

Outside packaging feels very sturdy and resists crushing by hand. The inside box is white with a PS Audio logo and LANRover USB Transporter printed on the side. On the top of the box is a white stick-on label with the product info, country of origin and UPC labels. The box is easy to open; when opened it displays the two pieces of the LR wrapped in plastic. Removing the LR modules and holder reveals an introduction letter, including the packing list, and the operator’s manual. Under the literature are the remaining contents: a short CAT 5e Ethernet cable, a flat-wired USB A to USB B cable, the power supply (not just a wall wart), and an AC cable for the power supply. Not included was any information regarding the Beta test requirements or duration of the test period.

I initially hooked the LR up to my office system listening with Nighthawk headphones.

First listen: The LR straight out of the box

I listened to 5 songs* with which I am familiar on my Nighthawks using the existing system; I then inserted the LR in to the system minus the Jitterbug and listened to the same 5 songs.

My initial impression is of a “bigger” sound. Further listening reveals a more open feel to the music as if some invisible edge has been removed. The leading edges of guitar and drum notes have a more natural sound. Listening to the system without the Jitterbug reveals greater differences. Another big improvement is the LR has completely eliminated the AC noise that the HUGO and/or the USB cable was picking up from the computer.

Further testing to come: I’m going to let the LR run overnight, listen again, and then move on to the Toy speakers, and maybe one of two bigger rigs, tomorrow. I will also be trying the LR with a Meridian Explorer 2 to see what difference it makes with a lower cost DAC ($299). Over the course of the next week or so I will try the LR with a PS Audio DirectStream DAC – Torres, an Audio Research Reference CD-9, and a Lindemann 825 CD/DAC. I will be using both Windows 10 and the latest version of the Apple operating system with the various DACs/players.

Bob

*”When I’m Gone,” Ani DiFranco, 16/44.1 Wav, Rip; “You Got Through,” Amber Rubarth, 24/192 Wav, H-D Tracks Download; “Carnival,” Natalie Merchant, 24/48 Wav, H-D Tracks Download; “Comfortable,” John Mayer, 16/44.1 Wav, Rip; “Black Boots,” Nils Lofgren, 16/44.1, Rip.

Well, my replacement LR showed up today. I’m very thankful to Paul and company for so quickly giving me another unit to try given my challenges with the first one. Unfortunately there truly is something in my setup that is incompatible with the LANRover system. I did try different USB cables, a different ethernet patch cord, all with the same result. Esoteric K-03X would show the sampling frequency, whether PCM or DSD, but no sound. Roon on the iPad would often skip through songs as if it couldn’t play them. I’m beginning to think I’m just cursed, but I know I’m not alone. I’m truly jealous of those for whom it has actually been a plug and play process. I have no doubt that the improvements in SQ are not subtle.

I’m going to keep mine, experiment a little while hopefully someone comes up with a magic combination that works with Esoteric or perhaps even a software update is considered. At some point I will regrettably have to drop out of the beta test if there is no answer.

crwilli said Does anybody have the LR running with a Windows PC and JRiver into any DAC?

Does anybody have the LR running with a Macintosh PC with any software into an Esoteric DAC?


I am running the LR out of a Windows PC (MacBook Pro running Windows 7) with JRiver MC v19. I’m working on my review and will post soon.

My standard system setup is as follows:

  • MacBook Pro (running Windows 7) with JRiver Music Center v19
  • Music library connected on Western Digital 1TB USB hard drive connected to MacBook
  • Audioquest “Forest” USB cable from MacBook feeding the DAC
  • PS Audio DirectStream DAC with “Torreys Final” firmware
  • Audioquest “Niagara” single-ended IC’s from DAC to Preamp
  • PS Audio GCP-200 Preamp with outboard Gain Cell Power Supply (GCPS)
  • DAC & GCPS powered by PS Audio P300 Power Plant
  • Audioquest “Niagara” balanced IC’s from Preamp to Amp
  • Krell FPB-600c Amp, fed by its own dedicated 20 amp circuit
  • Double bi-wire run of Audioquest “Volcano” speaker cable
  • MartinLogan “Prodigy” loudspeakers
  • Also run a pair of MartinLogan “Depth I” subwoofers, driven by the Aux outputs of the preamp
  • Power cables are all PS Audio xStream Audio “Statement”, except for the ML Prodigy’s and subs, which use xStream Audio “Plus” models
I received the Beta PS Audio LAN Rover (LR) system via Fedex today, and broke everything out of the boxes to check it out. Looks like there’s a nice set of instructions that I’ll read if I can’t get it to work on my own J

I kicked things off by listening to a few of my favorite recordings without the LAN Rover in place to give myself a baseline to work with. I’m actually still getting used to the sound of my system with the Torreys firmware in the DirectStream, so it makes it a little more “interesting” going into an evaluation of another change in the system. Similar to a note by another reviewer, I’m still trying to decide whether or not I actually like the Torrey’s FW vs. the previous Yale FW. More on that later…

After warming up to some Ryan Adams, Stevie Ray Vaughan, Springsteen, CSN, and Tedeschi-Trucks Band without the LR, I hooked it up as a replacement for the straight shot USB cable from PC to DAC. I used the included USB cable from the PC output to the LR Sender unit, the included short Cat5 cable between units, and my AQ USB cable from the Receiver unit to the DAC. Everything worked first try (as would be expected), proving once again that written instructions are really just for backup…

My initial impression of the sound with the LR pair inserted was very positive. I don’t think I saw a narrowing of the soundstage as some others noted, but I definitely did notice an improvement in the depth of stage. There was also a clearly discernable improvement in the separation of individual instruments/vocalists with the LR in the chain. Overall, I found the presentation of the music better focused.

Another thing I noticed was an improvement in the “blackness” of the background. Over the years, every time I thought my system truly had a black background, I would eventually improve something that made the background seem even blacker. I don’t know if there’s eventually a limit to the blackness of the background, but for now, I’ll just say it’s blacker than it used to be J .

Removing the LR and making a quick sweep through a half dozen tracks confirmed my initial observations. When I reinserted the LR, I decided to try swapping out the Cat5 jumper with a 3 meter section of Audioquest “Forest” Ethernet cable, which allowed me to move my laptop over to the other end of my rack, about 5 feet away from the DAC. To my surprise, I found this to further improve all of the above mentioned areas. I can’t say for certain whether it was inserting the AQ Ethernet cable, moving the laptop, or a combination of the two, but for the near future it’s going to stay this way.

This second configuration sent me down a path to further explore the effects of different cables within the LR chain, and I ordered a couple new USB’s (one AQ Diamond, and one AQ Carbon) and an AQ Vodka Ethernet cable. I should have all but the Diamond (backordered) by Friday, so I’ll have a follow-up after the weekend.

Circling back to the topic of preferred firmware in the DirectStream DAC, I shared the same experience as at least one other reviewer in that after inserting the LR pair, I finally feel that the Torrey’s FW actually exceeds the performance of the Yale FW. Now, of course, I can’t help but wonder if I paired the LR with the Yale FW if that combo would be EVEN BETTER…? I’m not going down that road right away, but maybe I’ll eventually try it.

Just getting the LANRover up and running. I am using a MacBook Pro and have tried several different audio players: Tidal, iTunes, Fidelia, BitPerfect. All have worked so far.

My standard audio chain consists of:

Oppo 103 (Transport via coax)

PWD Mk II (DAC)

Decware ZStage (Line Stage)

Pass Labs 30.8 Amp

Decware DM947 Monolith Speakers.

Using the LANRover, my audio chain consists of:

MacBook Pro

PS Audio LANRover

PWD Mk II

etc…

Using the toggle on the PS Audio PerfectWave Mk II, I can switch between the two systems instantly for AB testing. My initial impressions after an hour of listening is that the two systems sound very similar. I am having difficulty telling the difference between them in all honesty. I have more listening to do in the upcoming weeks, more equipment to switch around, etc… I’ll post my thoughts throughout the evaluation.

scirica said Well, my replacement LR showed up today. I'm very thankful to Paul and company for so quickly giving me another unit to try given my challenges with the first one. Unfortunately there truly is something in my setup that is incompatible with the LANRover system. I did try different USB cables, a different ethernet patch cord, all with the same result. Esoteric K-03X would show the sampling frequency, whether PCM or DSD, but no sound. Roon on the iPad would often skip through songs as if it couldn't play them. I'm beginning to think I'm just cursed, but I know I'm not alone. I'm truly jealous of those for whom it has actually been a plug and play process. I have no doubt that the improvements in SQ are not subtle.

I’m going to keep mine, experiment a little while hopefully someone comes up with a magic combination that works with Esoteric or perhaps even a software update is considered. At some point I will regrettably have to drop out of the beta test if there is no answer.


As we suspected, there’s nothing changed with the LANRover, so it’s in your setup. But that’s concerning because we need to figure out what’s going on.

Clearly the driver’s not getting recognized for some reason.

Remind me of the setup. Is it super simple? Supplied USB cable between computer and LANRover Sender, supplied Ethernet cable to receiver, short USB to DAC.

All lights indicate operation and connection.

Mine occasionally does the same thing where it makes no sound, yet everything’s connected. I have a Mac.

When this happens, I go to the Audio Midi setup screen or Preferences in Bit Perfect (but I don’t think you’re using Bit Perfect). I select the DAC’s driver, in my case the PS Audio driver, then I switch that to the Mac’s internal sound driver, then back again to the DAC driver. This seems to “wake up” the system and music plays.

Spent some time listening this morning. Whatever the cause I found the music more involving than it has been since the last time I “upgraded.”

On the other hand, when jumping around tracks I think I heard the beginning of tracks being messed up. Hard to describe but kind of like radio static. Jumping back and forth between 2 tracks did not have this distortion but jumping from a track in one album to a track in another did. Letting an album play in order did not have this problem.

My setup is MinimServer upsampling to 96K to a NUC running MPD controlled by Linn Kazoo. Hard to say where the above problem would be originating but I never noticed such a thing before putting the LR in.

Paul McGowan said
scirica said Well, my replacement LR showed up today. I'm very thankful to Paul and company for so quickly giving me another unit to try given my challenges with the first one. Unfortunately there truly is something in my setup that is incompatible with the LANRover system. I did try different USB cables, a different ethernet patch cord, all with the same result. Esoteric K-03X would show the sampling frequency, whether PCM or DSD, but no sound. Roon on the iPad would often skip through songs as if it couldn't play them. I'm beginning to think I'm just cursed, but I know I'm not alone. I'm truly jealous of those for whom it has actually been a plug and play process. I have no doubt that the improvements in SQ are not subtle.

I’m going to keep mine, experiment a little while hopefully someone comes up with a magic combination that works with Esoteric or perhaps even a software update is considered. At some point I will regrettably have to drop out of the beta test if there is no answer.

As we suspected, there’s nothing changed with the LANRover, so it’s in your setup. But that’s concerning because we need to figure out what’s going on.

Clearly the driver’s not getting recognized for some reason.

Remind me of the setup. Is it super simple? Supplied USB cable between computer and LANRover Sender, supplied Ethernet cable to receiver, short USB to DAC.

All lights indicate operation and connection.

Mine occasionally does the same thing where it makes no sound, yet everything’s connected. I have a Mac.

When this happens, I go to the Audio Midi setup screen or Preferences in Bit Perfect (but I don’t think you’re using Bit Perfect). I select the DAC’s driver, in my case the PS Audio driver, then I switch that to the Mac’s internal sound driver, then back again to the DAC driver. This seems to “wake up” the system and music plays.


Paul,

Can you share your bit perfect settings if you don’t mind? I am getting no sound if I use it with iTunes. thx.

Allan

Paul McGowan said
scirica said Well, my replacement LR showed up today. I'm very thankful to Paul and company for so quickly giving me another unit to try given my challenges with the first one. Unfortunately there truly is something in my setup that is incompatible with the LANRover system. I did try different USB cables, a different ethernet patch cord, all with the same result. Esoteric K-03X would show the sampling frequency, whether PCM or DSD, but no sound. Roon on the iPad would often skip through songs as if it couldn't play them. I'm beginning to think I'm just cursed, but I know I'm not alone. I'm truly jealous of those for whom it has actually been a plug and play process. I have no doubt that the improvements in SQ are not subtle.

I’m going to keep mine, experiment a little while hopefully someone comes up with a magic combination that works with Esoteric or perhaps even a software update is considered. At some point I will regrettably have to drop out of the beta test if there is no answer.

As we suspected, there’s nothing changed with the LANRover, so it’s in your setup. But that’s concerning because we need to figure out what’s going on.

Clearly the driver’s not getting recognized for some reason.

Remind me of the setup. Is it super simple? Supplied USB cable between computer and LANRover Sender, supplied Ethernet cable to receiver, short USB to DAC.

All lights indicate operation and connection.

Mine occasionally does the same thing where it makes no sound, yet everything’s connected. I have a Mac.

When this happens, I go to the Audio Midi setup screen or Preferences in Bit Perfect (but I don’t think you’re using Bit Perfect). I select the DAC’s driver, in my case the PS Audio driver, then I switch that to the Mac’s internal sound driver, then back again to the DAC driver. This seems to “wake up” the system and music plays.


Paul:

I would consider this “super simple”, yes. I have used the supplied USB from the computer to LR, and a 1.0 meter WireWorld Platinum USB from LR to DAC (Esoteric K-03X). I’ve used the supplied ethernet cable and also a “nicer” 0.5m ethernet cable that I had on hand. The PC is a dedicated audio computer (branded Silenzio) running RoonServer. My controllers for Roon are iOS devices (phone and ipad).

I have done a lot of sequencing of reboots of PC and DAC in various orders, and I’ve also reinstalled the Esoteric driver multiple times at different points in the reboot cycle.

The Esoteric seems to recognize the sampling frequency and displays it, but it never plays sound.

And you are correct. No bit perfect being used. I also have JRiver on the Silenzio and got the same error message that Crwilli received where it said it could not play 44.1. So it’s not exclusive to Roon.

Thanks for not giving up on me!

Steve