Rob, Worth giving it another 30 hours or so. 20 hours was not enough here. Your thought about low tech may not be unfounded. I’d suspect those $25 RCA cables are killing a lot of the nice things happening on the way to the Sennheisers.
Rob said After about 20 hours of burn-in I revisited the LR this morning
I think it needs more than 20. But the differences I think I may be hearing are really extremely subtle.
Today, after another 10 hours (so 70 total) the bass overripeness is gone again. I think.
I need to go back to my original setup at some point to see if I hear anything.
Ok, I got the LANRover on Thursday July 28th. The receiver has remained powered up the whole time, and I put many hours on the first unit. So, definitely it has been burned in. Lots of listening, and swapping it in and out.
My system is [used in review]:
Conrad Johnson CT5 preamp
Toshiba Laptop running Windows 10 with JRiiver 21 [used mostly with battery only, charger not plugged in]
Benchmark Dac2 HGC
Legacy Audio [Coda] High Current Stereo Amp
Legacy FOCUS speakers
PS Audio P300 [preamp,dac]
I was very excited and pleased to be part of the beta test, as I am on a tight budget, and improving my PC front end was something I could do now. I used a variety of music, CD rips, downloads of various resolutions, including DSD, also LPs digitized through a HRT Linestreamer+ at 24/96. I really wanted to be gobsmacked by the LANRover.
First of all I will say I had no problem with it linking up. After first install, I could remove and replace, only having to stop JRiver, hit the play arrow, and it worked.
I used the supplied cables, at times using an AQ Jitterbug in line or plugged into a second usb port. My output cable was an AQ Carbon 1.5m.
At it’s best I heard no change to the sound, and sometimes heard what I can only describe as less,the music just didn’t sound as complete as I hear with just the Jitterbug and Carbon feeding the dac.
I think I have a pretty good, highly resolving system, I hear all the “audiophile” detail, and I hear enjoyable music.
Wanting to be sure, I took the LANRover over to a friend’s who has an Audio Research Reference 6 preamp, Reference 75SE power amp, Vandersteen Treo CTs, and a Moon380D DSD dac. For the source we used his Aurender NT10. For reference we used three songs, A Jerry Jeff Walker he picked, Johnny Hartmann and John Coltrane’s “Lush Life” and Crash Test Dummies “Superman”, my choices. We started with the stock cables, and an AQ Diamond. At first I heard little difference, but he knows his system and pointed out that it flattened out the depth and with Coltrane the sax seemed locked to the left speaker with the LANRover in place. Once pointed out I heard it too, it was than obvious. We then tried swapping in better cables first replacing the stock usb cable with an AQ Carbon, a little better, and finally a AQ Vodka ethernet cable. With cables costing two to three times the cost of the LANRover, it got a little better, but never sounded as good as the system with just the Diamond in. On “Superman” the backing vocals were distinct, in there own space, with the LANRover they kind of blended together.
I think with all components, most everything is system dependent, and my system is where a LANRover is likely to end up. It seems that when the Apple sources worked, people heard improvement. With the Aurender and my PC it wasn’t an upgrade. I would say to anyone using the stock cables and happy, benefits should come from upgrading the stock cables.
Monday I will be calling PS Audio for a return authorization number.
Thanks to Allan and Paul. Here’s a message I sent to local audio friends who wanted to hear how my Beta Test was going:
After getting personal email from Paul McGowan regarding the MM setting to use, I am listening with sheer pleasure to the LANRover in my computer room. Playing Telegraph Road (courtesy of Chip) by Dire Straits and the presentation is absolutely stunning.Here's the current configuration:Mac Mini (source w/MIDI set at highest sampling rate) via USB > LANRover sender via Ethernet cable > LANRover receiver via USB > Directstream upgraded from PWD via AQ XLR interconnects > Luxman L5501A II integrated amplifier via AQ speaker cables > Von Schweikert VR-33 speakersSystem is power conditioned using PS Audio Dectet Power Conditioner. Combination of Pangea, PS Audio and AQ power cords.Tomorrow I'll transplant the MM/LR components back into the sound room out back and run it on the bigger system. Looking forward to hearing the deeper bass on the Sig 3As.So how does this compare to the Olive 04HD setup using AQ coax digital feed to the DS? Frankly, it outperforms the Olive at least at the sound levels (moderate, not house-shaking as you do Jason) I've tested.
Also should tell you I tried changing the Midi setting to see what would happen. Sound continued to work until I lowered the setting to 48 kHz. Then no sound again. BTW, I don’t see rates higher than 96 kHz until I select the PS Audio USB 2.0 at which point the higher resolutions appear.
For grins, in case anyone was curious if there is a level difference with the LR in (either volume or bass), I did some marginally scientific tests:
Placing a Schoeps cardioid mic about 3’ from the middle of one of the Quads, I recorded the beginning of Babylon Sisters .dsf played back in Audiogate via: 1) a single USB cable (Audio Sensibility Statement Silver), 2) the LANRover, and 3)my current GIUSB chain. For the two GIUSB chains, they had Audio Sensibility USBs on both ends, and CAT7 in between.
Also, I did the same with a AKG D112 kick mic about a foot from one of the JLAudio subs.
In both cases, all of the files were the same level, and have indistinguishable spectra.
This is not an exact enough test to be able to say there is no difference between them - it was purely to satisfy my curiosity as to whether one thing or the other was obviously louder, either overall or just in the bass. And it’s not even an absolute test of that, but if there had clearly been a dB or two’s difference between any of them, or the spectra in the low end looked significantly different, it would’ve been worth following up on. That this doesn’t show a difference DOES NOT mean they cannot sound different.
I think I am keeping the LR and won’t sent it back even though it won’t let me use Bit Perfect for playback. It adds another dimension to the music. It doesn’t just play louder but it is more musical than without. Now I just hope an affordable 3rd party power supply becomes available that can improve the LR further. Happy listening all. Thanks Paul and PS Audio for the beta testing opportunity and making this wonderful device for all music lovers in the world.
So far I’ve enjoyed the LR and am definitely not sending it back. I’ve been using a Mac Mini with Roon>HQPlayer>AQ Carbon USB>LR sender>supplied ethernet connector> LR receiver>Nordost Blue Heaven USB>PSA NuWave DAC. Keep in mind that this is all with my Mac Mini on top of my rack. So now I want to physically move the MM away from the rest of the components to reduce RF/EMI coming from the MM, but not totally out of the room. I rip a lot of my records on the MM so keeping it in the same room would be infinitely more convenient. But that begs the question: would I get more SQ benefit by moving the MM about 15’ away to the other side of the room and use a high quality, but much longer, ethernet cable rather than keeping it on top of the rack? I was planning on using 18’ Blue Jeans cat6 cable, which are supposedly very good quality. I repeatedly hear that there is a benefit to moving the CPU away from the other components, but is this for certain? I guess I’ll test this out by moving the MM and do my own tests, but I find it difficult to do an accurate A:B comparison by separating listening sessions while switching cables/moving components, etc. Even if I don’t hear a difference, I’ll probably keep the MM in the other side of the room, though. Would love to hear you guys’ experiences with this.
I am using my mac mini as a media center in my living room. Besides listening to music, I also use it to watch a lot of music videos on youtube. The sound of those videos will benefit from the LR as well. I also have a external bluray burner connect to the mac mini to watch movies and rip CDs. For me, the pros outweighs the cons. Just my 2 cents.
It seems to me that, barring connection problems, apple computer users are generally blown away by the improvements.
A quick scan back through this thread makes me believe that those few that don’t find big differences are using MS operating systems, as I am.
July 29, 2016
12:52 am
In three separate PC systems I have tested the LanRover in so far, I cannot say there is any real difference in the perceived sound
July 30, 2016
12:24 pm
I really wanted to be gobsmacked, but have only had moments of subtle improvement. I am going to take it over to friends next week, he has the ears. I am beginning to wonder if at 61 my hearing is as good as I think it is.
July 30, 2016
4:07 pm
Now about the sound: I find the Rovers clearly cleaner and more transparent (“thinner”) and the sound stage a bit wider and deeper. What’s not sounding as good with them is smoothness, coherence and sense of presence (or engagement),
July 30, 2016
11:52 pm
Tested the old laptop … The sound between the two sources was IMO identical.
I then turned on the desktop computer where I am testing as an attempt to induce some noise… no diff.
August 2, 2016
7:52 am
ME
1) Does the LanRover make an audible difference?
Yes
…
5) Are the differences large enough to justify keeping it?
Unfortunately, no
August 6, 2016
3:11 pm
At it’s best I heard no change to the sound, and sometimes heard what I can only describe as less,the music just didn’t sound as complete as I hear with just the Jitterbug and Carbon feeding the dac.
Wanting to be sure, I took the LANRover over to a friend’s… At first I heard little difference, but he knows his system and pointed out that it flattened out the depth…
However it appears the majority of beta testers will be keeping their LanRovers. 
You missed the follow up from this Win 10/PC user (LANRover replacing Regen and Jitterbug, stock cables, except per signature):
With some burnin, my feelings about LR so far are similar to that of rvw1951.
That referred to rvw1951’s post on pg 8 (he has a Mac Mini and uses Audirvana+):
"On all types of music, I immediately noticed a “blacker” or more silent background. Air around instruments and voices was very definitely increased (not subtle). Voices and instruments seemed to meld in a very natural way and I had the sense I really became much more involved in the performance, as if I were closer to “being there”. There was a “smoothness” (or, perhaps, a lessening in “harshness”) to voices and violins that I hadn’t experienced before. I definitely heard more details, particularly in quieter passages, that I had never heard before. I think the soundstage got deeper, but it may be just more clarity. I didn’t get a sense of the soundstage getting narrower.
The track of music that I keep going back to is the one that now gives me goosebumps and tears at the same time: Cecilia Bartoli’s 96/24 album “Mission”, track 11. In this beautiful piece her voice is very quiet and controlled and it sounds like she is being bathed and totally surrounded in beautiful, soft violins.
It’s this increase in details that I’ve never heard before, and the newly heard absence of harshness, that assuredly means I’ll be keeping my LANRover in my system. Thank you PSAudio for a relatively inexpensive piece of hardware that makes, for me, a huge difference."
Dr. W saidI don't fit your generalization there, Dr. W. I am using OS X on a MacBook Pro that is also my personal computer, and I have yet to hear a dependable difference with the LR (vs. direct connection with a cheap, 6' long USB cable). Will be listening again today once I reach 40 hours of burn-in.A quick scan back through this thread makes me believe that those few that don’t find big differences are using MS operating systems, as I am.
An interesting observation, Dr. W
While I expect exceptions, it will be interesting to see if the general trend continues.
highstream said"On all types of music, I immediately noticed a “blacker” or more silent background. Air around instruments and voices was very definitely increased (not subtle). Voices and instruments seemed to meld in a very natural way and I had the sense I really became much more involved in the performance, as if I were closer to “being there”. There was a “smoothness” (or, perhaps, a lessening in “harshness”) to voices and violins that I hadn’t experienced before. I definitely heard more details, particularly in quieter passages, that I had never heard before. I think the soundstage got deeper, but it may be just more clarity. I didn’t get a sense of the soundstage getting narrower.
The track of music that I keep going back to is the one that now gives me goosebumps and tears at the same time: Cecilia Bartoli’s 96/24 album “Mission”, track 11. In this beautiful piece her voice is very quiet and controlled and it sounds like she is being bathed and totally surrounded in beautiful, soft violins.
It’s this increase in details that I’ve never heard before, and the newly heard absence of harshness, that assuredly means I’ll be keeping my LANRover in my system. Thank you PSAudio for a relatively inexpensive piece of hardware that makes, for me, a huge difference."
Thanks!! Our pleasure.
LANRover is bringing so much enjoyment to so many people.
Rob,
Point well taken. I did not mean to indicate that ALL Apple OS users universally had excellent results. Nor that all MS OS users were experiencing very little to no improvement.
My observation was that it seemed to me the majority of those that were not blown away tended to be MS OS (Windows) users.
Yes Elk,
If it really is a “trend” it will be interesting to see if it continues.
Bruce
It may be true. Computers have all sorts of idiosyncrasies and are not designed and manufactured with high-end audio in mind. Go figure.
Dr. W said Rob,Seems to me if anything is to be drawn it's that the most frequent ("consistent") comments refer to problems getting playback with one or more players, if at all, and a good many, if not majority of them are coming from Apple users. Moreover, the comments are coming from very different kinds and sophistication of systems.Point well taken. I did not mean to indicate that ALL Apple OS users universally had excellent results. Nor that all MS OS users were experiencing very little to no improvement.
My observation was that it seemed to me the majority of those that were not blown away tended to be MS OS (Windows) users.
Yes Elk,
If it really is a “trend” it will be interesting to see if it continues.
Bruce
My experience with the LanRover as Beta Tester.
I listen to ITunes on my I Mac.
I used OPPO Headphone Amp HA-1 using OPPO PM-1 Headphones.
First just straight from iMac to OPPO using Kimber Cable USB.
Second I listened using REGEN interface IMAC and OPPO.
Third I listened using the LANRover.
I expected a noticeable improvement with the LANRover and It Delivered. The sound was clearer, more focused, greater depth, clarity, separation of the instruments. Voices were sharper in both low and high ends. The sound stage Felt more Real. The music was easier to listen to for longer periods of time with no fatigue. I heard subtle sounds more distinctly and each instrument seems to have better present on the sound stage.
Most importantly for me is that I enjoy the music more with the LANDRover in my system. That intangible emotion responce-- that why we listen to music–the pleasure we feel when the music sounds right is enhanced when the LaNRover was deployed.
Thanks to PS AUDIO for a job well done.
Brooks
So, I think I was the first one out of the gate. After the initial testing, I have been focused on player compatibility and cable effect. I decided to try to switch back to the Regen setup before the change to the LR.
2 things come to mind:
- The LR is really something special in my system. I have unsolved compatibility issues with some of the other players, but I don't really care. It's really a transformational type change.
- I'm totally amazed at how fast a transformational change becomes the new norm. Switching back is always amazing to me.
At this point, I think that I have about 60 hours of playing time on the LR, and have found that it has become an integral part of my system. Clarity, definition, soundstage, bass, a black, silent background… you name it - all have improved. I run a basic, straightforward digital front end, mostly a MacBook Pro and occasionally an iMac > LR > NuWave DSD. I’ve streamed Tidal, JRiver MC 21, iTunes with Bitperfect, and CD’s. I had some problems with JRiver not working, but was able to resolve that by resetting everything so that I could listen to it over the computer speakers, and then gradually resetting everything. I just downloaded MC 22, so I may run into the same issue. Never had any problems with iTunes or Bitperfect. I’ve not swapped cables very much, but am planning on getting a pair of short USB cables to see if there is an improvement to be had. I’ve used a 25 foot Belkin CAT 6 cable between the sender/receiver when I was using the iMac, and didn’t notice any difference. I’ve thought about trying out a CAT 7 cable, just out of curiosity. The supplied CAT 5 cable has been in use most of the time, as has the supplied USB cable in between the computer and sender.
The verdict? I’m keeping the LANRover, and have been very happy with it.
brookbeach@comcast.net said My experience with the LanRover as Beta Tester.I listen to ITunes on my I Mac.
I used OPPO Headphone Amp HA-1 using OPPO PM-1 Headphones.
First just straight from iMac to OPPO using Kimber Cable USB.
Second I listened using REGEN interface IMAC and OPPO.
Third I listened using the LANRover.
I expected a noticeable improvement with the LANRover and It Delivered. The sound was clearer, more focused, greater depth, clarity, separation of the instruments. Voices were sharper in both low and high ends. The sound stage Felt more Real. The music was easier to listen to for longer periods of time with no fatigue. I heard subtle sounds more distinctly and each instrument seems to have better present on the sound stage.
Most importantly for me is that I enjoy the music more with the LANDRover in my system. That intangible emotion responce-- that why we listen to music–the pleasure we feel when the music sounds right is enhanced when the LaNRover was deployed.
Thanks to PS AUDIO for a job well done.
Brooks
Thanks Brooks!