My speaker cables are short but my XLR’s are 32’ long.
I dont think I am the only one with long XLR’s but in my research Galen mentioned that they will go 50’ with no issues at all.
I dont regret the purchase at all and after 3 or so years they are still in my system purring along as needed. I dont think you will find a better value for money spent.
I believe Luca had the 30’ plus Iconoclast Gen2 SPTPC speaker cables in his system not too long ago, and he said there is no SQ difference from a shorter one that he could detect (he moved the gears to the sidewall from between speakers).
Thanks dchang05
Luca is particular; If he says no SQ difference, must be so. In my case, Iconoclast II-TPC also sound great. I needed to route through a custom in-wall conduit above fireplace. Couldn’t use XLRs and trigger cables to amps on floor behind Maggies. That is where ASC Tube Traps live.
Sorry guys, I’ve just seen your posts.
I had and still have in use (for vinyl rig) Iconoclast XLR UPOCC 28 ft long and can confirm that that kind of length is not a problem.
Never tried Icono speaker cables, and in any case I always had short runs from amps to speakers.
Oh, I got confused with IC vs SC in your case. Did you order Dream V18-T? Let me know how does it compare with Well. I used to have Robin Hood bi-wired, but Stealth is in my mind lately.
Yep! I’ll surely do.
Just my 2 cents: look also
to Analysis-Plus cables. You can get it in any length and they sound really musical without skin effects.
All cables have skin effect and proximity effects. This isn’t a disease, just normal physics from a wire’s self inductance magnetic field properties. No worries about having “it”! All wires have it.
Worrying about skin effect by itself isn’t the right design direction. When more important variables are addressed, it automatically reduces skin effects and proximity effects right along with them. So at least some directly proportional relationship work in a cable’s favor if they are designed to manage more than skin effects.
Spoken as someone who has skin in the game.
Hey, I’m not a physic guy but I trust the white papers of Mark Markel (R.i.P.) and he was a scientist and also some of his “comrade-in-arms”. And they have proven that all cable GEOMETRIES (especially round cables) have skin effects - except the oval one. No skin effect! And that’s why AP has patented this thing. And personally I can’t think of any other cable that is able to reproduce sound colors (overtone series of instruments and voices) as beautifully as the Gold cables from AP. And the rest of the music reproduction are on the same level. You can’t argue about taste, but you can’t argue about patents and scientific findings either.
One of these days…
When you go after ONE variable you aren’t getting it done. Skin effect is one of the least important variables in an audio cable. Where audio cables and all analog cables have problems, is in time coherence and skin effect doesn’t directly impact that. We tend to hook onto fancy materials or a one shot variable reduced to the maximum or minimum. How many lowest inductance cables to do we need with super high capacitance?
They aren’t describing skin effect but proximity effect caused by current in a wire altering the current distribution. The same current direction between two wires pushes the current field “OUT”, and differing current direction pull the fields “in” to the wires center. Not the same thing as skin effect at all.
The capacitance and inductance of a cable is FLAT with frequency, so the cable doesn’t change L and C as frequency is changed. And ya, that’s the science. I test L and C at 1 KHz to calculate the impedance of RF cables. Why? There is no need to test higher than that as it is the same value and more accurate tested at lower frequencies. Inductance can change SLIGHTLY (drops) as frequency goes up as the “average” distance between the magnetic field between wires changed due to skin effect moving most of the current to the wire surface, but this is a really small change. Send me your cables and I’ll test L and C and prove it to you.
Wire efficiency increases with reduced size, making complex wire shapes unnecessary and why they aren’t the best scientific solution to a myrid of concurrent problems. There is a lot more than latching onto a magic term or variable to make exceptional cable but the audio market is famous for a new word, material or “discovery”. We tend to drop what we are holding all together and jump to the next thing with nary a thought as to how the interrelated variables all work together.
We reduce skin effect why (improved proximity effect is what is actually shown)? How does that change the time based distortion in an analog cable? Sure, it can change the proximity effect based on geometry but that isn’t boiled down to time based frequency driven problems. Until we do all that, we aren’t done yet, we just got started.
The major distortion in analog cables is the velocity of propagation non linearity caused by physics we just can’t escape. Vp is zero at DC (the signal is always there), and goes to the limiting Vp of the dielectric at RF (up to 100% in theory). Between those two points we have a exponential curve that defines how a particular cable works. ALL analog frequency cables have this distortion and nothing, not even “no skin effect”, can change that.
The above comment isn’t to shoot arrows at anybody, it is to illustrate a more holistic approach needs to be defined before we make a cable and how it ALL, not piece parts, work together to make cable better. And yes, it is a design to a cost problem as well. We all want to enjoy the results and be able to afford it.
The situation isn’t removing skin effect at all with changes to the wire’s shape, it is that it is probably the least important to audio looked at as a single variable. If you want to buy a single optimized variable, sure, there are all out there for R, L and C.
The trick is to optimize the ENTIRE set of variables through audio and place a butcher’s thumb on the ones that have the most influence on time propagation.
Patents are meaningless until they are challenged. What are the first and most important claim? Is it an artwork patent or a design patent? I can go on and on but patents don’t have much say with regards to “findings” and the science most of the time. They are primarily designed to exclude, and that’s usually not done with the science. I have over thirty patents and trust me, sales and marketing want exclusion more than the science.
Fascinating stuff
Thanks!
Wow, you seem to be a specialist and I can’t argue against that. What remains is my statement that I know of no other cable that reproduces such timbres and also fulfills all other criteria of outstanding sound quality (not only) for me.
I doubt anyone will argue you do not happen to know of any other cable you like as much in your system. 
And, yes, he is a bit of a specialist.
I want to like Analysis Plus cables but found them to sound awful in my system of the time.
Here is actual test data to show what’s happening with cables;
The capacitance of 9515 (multi-pair cable - Computer EIA RS-232 Cable, 24 AWG stranded (7x32) tinned copper conductors, semi-rigid PVC insulation, 15 twisted pairs,overall Beldfoil® shield (100% coverage), 24 AWG stranded tinned copper drain wire, PVC jacket.) changes based on the pairs ground plane based on the location inside the group of pairs. It has higher capacitance on an outer (o) pair that is near the shield, and lower capacitance on the inner(I) pairs farther away from the shield. And, 9515 uses a PVC dielectric which changes with frequency and capacitance is determined by the dielectric constant.
The Inductance also drops, but could care less about the capacitance of the dielectric. It is determined by the current density between two wires. The closer the current is, the lower the inductance. As frequency goes up, the skin effect pushes the current to the wire(s) surface changing the electromagnetic field and thus the electromagnetic field is “closer” and this drops inductance. It doesn’t keep dropping, but hits a knee area and then remains pretty flat after that.
Cables with good dielectrics don’t see capacitance change, and cables that use different wire permeability will exhibit slightly different inductance curves as frequency goes up. 9269 is copper covered steel as an example.
So there we have it. This is even what ALL our audio cables do. Notice the frequency divisions before you apply significance.
Best,
Galen
Thank you very much for all of your findings and explanations. Well, ultimately I can only really judge what I hear myself. Experience with other audiophiles is also helpful. So we (11 high-end listeners) got together and compared 10 speaker cables with each other. These included: Audioquest Dragons, Nordost Valhalla, HMS Grand Finale Jubilee, the most expensive XLO, Siltech (forgot the name), Straightwire, the Golden Reference from Analysis-Plus and other well-known and excellent cables. The cables were always listened to and evaluated intensively on the same high-end system by all those present, then the 3 best-sounding cables were compared against each other again. The winner with 10 out of 11 competitors was the Analysis-Plus. I felt the same way. The result was impressive. It may be that it would have been different with a different combination of components, but nonetheless… Many paths ultimately lead to individual, personal musical heaven, regardless of the scientific, metallurgical and other experiences that are certainly necessary. Happy exploring and happy listening.
Translated with DeepL.com (free version)
Very interesting and I have no experience with Analysis-plus cable. But if I remember right a few here had moved from it to iconoclast cables🤔
I had Analysis Plus along the way. I am sad I sold it.
Always go with the cable or component which sounds best to you.
