You don’t need dealers where there are few people and the people that are there have little money.
That only leaves a few large metros that have population with money. Hence the rest of the dealers disappearing. If list price was still being paid and protected by dealer - supplier relationships there would be more stocking dealers. Probably less than 1% of the 1% care about stereo at all. High end manufacturers that produce a high quality piece will always have business as they don’t need local dealers to survive. A large portion of their sales come from owner recommendations to friends and acquaintances.
My business as an example has survived and prospered for 40 years without one advertisement ever being purchased.
Your latter experience is all too common. For whatever reason I think a lot of these dealers wanted to be rock stars and this is all they could do. In many cases you get the feeling someone feels you are an inconvenience. It isn’t just the internet killing these stores. Hell,I’m an audiophile and hesitate to go in.
That store in Germany that will ship like that to do comparisons? That is pretty amazing. I’d want to give them my money. But when you essentially got a guy providing you the internet experience at full asking price? Pass. And that is what a lot of these brick and mortars started doing. They lowered their bar to compete w the internet. Then got some attitude when you chose the internet over them. Sure there are certain shops that stand above the rest - but far too many are not up to it.
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i see a decline in dealers to continue, but eventually, like vinyl, they shall rise again. I just don’t know if it will be in my lifetime.
Unfortunately, very liberal return policies of online dealers contribute to that. Great for consumers, in the narrow view, but in the long view??? Just like the disdain for vinyl, dealers shall rise again!! During my lifetime??? Who knows, I gave up trying to figure out humanity. And, is humanity even humane??? Hmmmmmm.
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Good and innovative dealers will prevail. Every market has to deal with on line services these days. So I utilize both to my best convenience.
Yes, liberal return policies can be an issue. Dealers thus need to have loaner stock available for their customers to bring home to try. A good many dealers have done this for years.
The main aspect I think about regarding the online business without dealers is, that it is unfortunate with top high end gear to have it regularly demo‘ed at home in a not burned in status. This could lead to wrong conclusions about their sound quality as no one will probably be able to have it at home as long as necessary for burn in.
It would work if always the same few units are shipped around to customers…if enough are planned for that and occasionally sold to customers for a better price, it could work.
It would work better, yes. But I trust that room acoustics and system synergy of your home system has a bigger impact than burned in equipment.
It is also not guaranteed that the gear is burned in when just placed in the shop to demo upon your request.
A good point; a piece of equipment offered as a demo needs to be at its best.
And we know how much different e.g. a DS sounds fresh and burned in…it’s simply not possible to decide unless burned in.
But it’s right that at a less good dealer, this can also happen in a shop.
Though interesting, maybe we should give this academic exercise concerning the changing role of the dealer, a new topic title, as it no longer is a reflection on, or description of, the new PSA speaker(s).
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The discussion is about how to audition the PS Audio speakers. In North America PS Audio sells without dealers direct. In Europe there are less and less dealers to go to, and certainly not every dealer is willing to take EUR 20.000+ speakers in the hope that anyone would come and listen or even buy them.
Current options are:
- only if Corona allows, go on vacation to Colorado and pay PS Audio a visit, Colorado is worth a vacation.
- in North America only: fork out US$ 20.000, order them and return within 14 days, then pray they arrive back without damage and that you get money returned
- outside North America (now it gets complicated) search on PS Audio’s WEB site for the national sales representative / importer, call that sales rep / importer if he knows a dealer who demonstrates the speaker to allow you to audition them, very likely take 2 vacation days to travel there and back (hope it is a nice area)
- stop wining and put those US$ 20.000 on the table because PS Audio’s speakers are the best
While I think that any of these options may be fun to many who have US$ 20.000 and more to burn, I question if this will do for the Audiophile who spends all his hard earned money on audio equipment instead of going on vacation or even skipping other expenses that can make a life more joyful.
I like the idea of ordering a test package, pay for the transport forth and back. That transport might cost a couple of hundred dollars but that is probably less then traveling to Boulder or the nearest dealer that allows you to audition them, plus you can listen in your home environment with your own sources and amplifiers. Also I think that if you plan pay US$ 20.000 those transport costs for auditioning the PS Audio speakers might become negotiable.
Whether every sales rep / importer outside the US is willing to provide such deal (investing in a pair of this speakers, that cost them a lot less than the consumer by the way) remains to be seen. But I think it pays off for them looking at the markup PS Audio customers pay outside North America.
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While it’s rather silent perhaps a guess how the new speakers could look:
These are the new Swiss HD Overture speakers. A beautiful design, in the Bang & Olufsen and Sonus Faber league. Swiss high end technology from Rowen.
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actually there is an addendnum to the European route:
- Relize in Europe those very same speakers cost 45.000 USD because the dealer who will NOT keep them in house for a demo and will order them just if you provide a hefty down-payment (using your money to run his business)and you are left wondering why he charges you for 25K more just for placing an order over the internet and provide you with an invoice.
- Plan a trip to Colorado ( when covid allows it) and convince a mildly pi$$ed Paul to sell them to you bypassing his local dealer because the dealer provides and added cost but not an added value
- organize a currier to ship the speakers to your location and be prepared about 20% sale tax, which is annoying but it is still better that paying a 100%markup to a bloodsucker for the pleasure of doing absolutely nothing for you.
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My experience with Audio Dealer’s in the 80’s and 90’s up in Canada or in the early 00’s in New Jersey was always a good experience and I would never have trusted ecommerce to do my audio shopping back then anyway.
It was the perfect lure for me as a kid in the 80’s, as a young adult in the 90’s, and as a newly married guys in the 00’s.
Fast forward to my re-entry into mostly the 2 Channel world in the last few years (still love my 5.1 though) and everything in my rig is bought through ecommerce. When Dealers are by appointment only or know that that you are just coming in to “kick the tires”. It’s not a beneficial visit for you or them. Back in the day, a kid could walk into a Dealer and buy a whatever they needed and get to hear some great gear without any intimidation. Just an appreciation that someday I’d get to that level.
Moving back to the U.S. and again the lure of high end is just a stones throw away from me and with a 30 day money back in many cases. Mostly made in the U.S.A. products as well.
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Living in a country with very limited supply (Brazil), I must say that going through a dealer is a must. Not only will he take care of all the bureaucracy of importing (in Brazil, importing fees amount to 80% product costs plus shipping costs), but also will provide assistance should anything go south (and definitely you don’t wanna pay back and forth shipping of behemoths).
But, for me, the main value is in the “consulting business”. Again, being in a country with limited supply, it is always good to have some advice regarding equipment
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Back to topic. I have followed the progression of the now FR 80 with great interest as it has morphed into many thinks along its course, and I have enjoyed being in the loop on its progress.
Now, with corporate radio silence on this model, I would like an update on what it is to become, and a projected price and release target. I understand that too much info can get you in trouble but no info creates no interest. I have held my speaker purchase pending PSA’s first offering. Can’t hold it much longer.
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Those Overture speakers are perfect example of great contemporary design.
Yes, I can bring you up to date. The new IDs are done and moving forward. It is back to being called the FR30 (don’t ask. It was my bad). It has 4 8” woofers and a massive passive radiator on each side of the lower cabinet. In the upper cabinet is the same 10” planar ribbon and ribbon tweeter, with another ribbon tweeter on the rear. The F#30 is 100% passive. It is thin, stands just under 5 feet tall and is to my eye and everyone that’s seen it, beautiful.
We’ve fingers crossed it can come in at $15K the pair but that is in flux until the final numbers come in. The current schedule has finished prototypes from the factory delivered to us in December 2020. We could be in the alpha testing phase as early as the first quarter, and beta in the second quarter.
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