My catma beats your dogma. Every time.
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So all this talk about bass. How low do it go?
I’m disappointed to learn no servo, those who purchased AN3 will be even more disappointed once/if the AN2 and AN1 get the servo controlled woofers. AN3 seems like a big compromised then.
I interpreted that with the new drivers no servo is better generally and not only in the AN-3.
Better choosing the better sounding option than keeping the servo for the sake of principle, right? I guess Chris brought in some questioning of things going ahead with his newly designed components.
Easily in the low 20’s, I would hazard to guess. Maybe lower, but my listening time was extremely limited. To my ears, the prototypes in no way were deficient in low end extension. And all of that “subsonic” space to the soundstage that subwoofers provide was definitely present.
Keep in mind that the bass is still a work in progress. Servo control is not off the table. Nor is it for sure on the table, either. Or so I’m told. There is also a feedback control scheme (mentioned somewhere in the past) that Chris has come up with that uses measured room response as an alternative to accelerometers.
Servo control is a means to an end (low distortion), and is not a unique solution. So we’ll just have to wait to see which alternative is chosen.
I stopped by the PS Audio suite today and both the static and dynamic displays were very nice. Lots of buzz about the new speakers and I must say I liked them very much both aesthetics and sound. With the variable controls it seems that it would be easy to get these babies sounding outstanding in most rooms.
Congratulations Paul!
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Not defending Paul, I would be inclined, but I think that would be very presumptuous of me.
My observations over the last two years has been that Paul has shared a lot of bits and pieces about his speaker projects. He never made any promises to me, yet I have enjoyed the trip immensely. We may see more twist and turns before the sales brochure is distributed, so enjoy the ride.
BTW I also enjoy each and everyone’s comments and thoughts on the subject.
Chas
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@ 1cdfoley… I think you are correct. It’s much easier to do a skunk works project then show up with the “ta da” here it is moment. Being open, transparent, and bringing others along with development, including changes, setbacks and ultimately success is much more difficult but is how teams and long term businesses are built. I use the same methodology in the Medical Device manufacturing world and it is indeed very difficult and there is always waiting with a brick to throw… but the results are worth it.
Paul explained above that AN used cheap woofers with weak magnets and presumably the servo was meant to fix the inherent weakness of such drivers. The servo approach may therefore be redundant if better drivers are used.
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Yes, I read this.
I just made a quick google search at the PSAudio site and found dozens of links to cites of Paul like the following, which are not related to a limited reason where servos are better, but to statements why there’s no proper bass reproduction possible without generally.
That’s what I meant.
As I said, I have no problem with change…I just avoid fooling myself by pretending the very last explanatory statement was the same as the dozens before. And I think Arnie’s special woofer technology wasn’t the only one Paul knew so far, otherwise he wouldn’t have bickered with him about it. I think the reason of the day will be that Chris’ woofer construction is the first and probably only one which makes an abandonment of servos possible and that’s ok for me ;- ) As it seems not finally decided yet, maybe the servo even comes back anyway.
https://www.psaudio.com/pauls-posts/lightning-fast/
“…,Which is why a proper servo bass system is the only woofer technology I know of that can keep pace with the demands of music.
And, since the sole purpose of our new speaker line is to honor the music, an accelerometer-based servo woofer system is a prerequisite for a full range setup.”
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I do take stuff like that with a pinch of salt, as it’s obviously rubbish. If you’ve heard something like the PMC BB5 SE you’d agree.
I’ve heard the PMC Fenestria at the last HiFi shows, they have great bass, I agree.
i own the PCM XB3…their largest transmission line…
best sub ever…no gimmicks to help enhance needed…
the wave is 13 ft before it leaves the speakers…in my 25 space from speaker to me…that’s a 50% longer bass note wave that allows much deeper extension of the base frequencies…clean
As I have tried to say more than once, and am probably not doing a very good job, we have made
no decision on the servo in or out. And whatever we do decide will follow into the AN2 and AN1.
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Yes, that’s about right. Thanks!
I’d just like to say paul - thank you for taking us on this ‘sausage making’ journey. Obviously not everybody - in fact nobody - does this. It’s a lot of fun for me to see the progression. This isn’t about ‘promises’ or what you have said in the past. This is about product development. I think the saying to keep in your back pocket is ‘I reserve the right to get smarter’. We should all remember that. Thanks again. Sounds like the show is going great.
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I attended the packed spinning vinyl with Michael Fremer session yesterday, and it was one of the most fun experiences I’ve had at RMAF, despite having to stand the entire time (next to Paul, for much of it). Baba O’Reilly and Stairway to Heaven from Michael’s rare Classic Records 45rpm test pressings sounded phenomenal, with Stairway getting a round of applause. Well done! I’d always figured the Vandersteen Quatro CT’s would be my retirement gift a couple of years down the road, but that plan might well have changed!
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Here, here!
Paul is an unapologetic enthusiast. I am sure he drives his staff and management crazy with his proclamations, about faces, twists and turns; and (IMO) well-intentioned hyperbole (no offense intended @Paul).
Paul and I have never met, but I feel like I know him through his various internet-based interactions with the public and his customers. Over time, I have come to take his proclamations with a grain of salt or two.
Don’t go changing, Paul. Guard your integrity and be careful to speak the truth in objective matters, but be you. I can’t think of a more open and vulnerable company principal in this business. I’ll take the “good with the bad” in order to continue to have the insight into your avocation that you are offering.
Here is some encouragement (another very successful guy whose “calls” can be frustrating at times):
As timm remarks above, most of us truly appreciate you doing all of this real time with us. I can’t think of any other manufacturers that would be willing to bare themselves in the process of making a fine product. To allow us the opportunity to see your thought/design process, the mistakes and trial and error of it, the changes…all of it is fascinating and very unique. Then to have to come on here and explain yourself as to why or why not your doing it (and the chickens clucking (and I have been one on occasion)). Very commendable indeed.
Not being a sports fan I haven’t any clue who that is but I get the metaphor. Thanks.
I can (and do) get excited and carried away. I am (more than) prone to exaggeration, but it’s always heartfelt and most of my family take what they wish from it.
I appreciate the kind words. I don’t think I could change if I wanted to at this late stage in the game.
I am still focused on breaking new ground and getting more than we should wrung out of designs. It’s what keeps me/us going.
Our team was chosen for their passion.
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