Ripping DSD from SACD


#1

Hi,

Sorry if something similar has been posted before.

I’m a new PS Audio DirectStream DAC owner. This is also my first PS Audio product, but it won’t be my last. I absolutely love the DS DAC and haven’t enjoyed my music this much since I was a boy and listened to Vinyl (records as we used to call them) on my father’s bar system lol. I remember being back there putting on his albums and scratching the living heck out of them lol. Poor guy.

I previously had a Mytek Brooklyn with a PSU which was good, but DirectStream blows it out of the water. The Mytek is very “digital” to me and can sometimes be “harsh” sounding. It uses an ESS Sabre DAC 9018. Unlike many others, I did not feel it had a good headphone amp at all either. Anyway, I digress. Prior to that, I was using my Oppo 105D DAC which wasn’t too bad, but below the Mytek, and prior to that I was using an old Benchmark DAC1 I bought from a recording studio for $700 at the time which was a deal. I have been using an Oppo 105D and Oppo 203 to play my CDs and SACDs/DVD-Audio discs.

I plan on buying a DirectStream memory player down the road to play my SACDs which I had somewhat abandoned in recent years. I have an Oppo 105D (Darbee edition) and 203. I found out the Vanity HD203 is $800 or so and did not want to pay that now to get my OPPO to output to the Directstream. Also don’t have time for the project to go directly to its I2S. So, this got me to really want to get the DSD files off of my SACDs. It happens that I have an original launch fat PS3, but my firmware is past 3.55 (darn me and my OCD). I didn’t really want to open it up and do the E3 flasher to downgrade the firmware.

So I discovered you can put a file on a USB thumb drive and use an OPPO 103/105 or 105D to rip the SACDs (sorry the 4K 203 and 205 don’t work at this time). You can either make an ISO file or DSF (or DFF) of the stereo and/or multichannel as a backup and to play on the direct stream. I bought the lifetime ROON which for $500 was a great deal and I HIGHLY recommend it. There are also some other players that work and they are listed. I did not develop this process, but will provide you with instructions for those of you that don’t know about it.

Here is what you need:

Your SACDs you own (This is NOT for pirating of course, support the artists)

USB thumb drive

OPPO 103, 105, or 105D (or other compatible player, some of the SONY’s)

WIFI or ethernet

Download of ISO2DSD – This is what you use to get the DSD file to your Computer via wi-fi or ethernet

http://www.sonore.us/apps2.html Read This:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/fsigs8b3m24ld56/AACV2LC2EHfEdiS41fQmlKPxa?dl=0&preview=Ripping+SACDs+using+an+Oppo+103+or+105.docx

Basically, put the Autoscript files on the root drive of your USB thumb drive after you unzip it. Check your OPPOs IP Address and write it down. You may want to enter a manual IP address otherwise, its possible it may assign a different one the next time, but not likely. Turn off autoplay and resume function. May want to turn off standby mode too, but not certain if that matters. I just did to be safe.

Turn it back off after you get the IP address. Then, place the thumb drive in your OPPO or compatible player with the OPPO off. Turn it on. You know it is working if when it comes on the tray immediately ejects and you see a wifi or ethernet symbol on it to the right of where it says HOME or SACD I think. After the tray opens, close the tray.

Go back to your computer, open ISO2DSD, choose server input and enter your IP address you wrote down. The port number you can leave the same unless you are using that port. 2002 worked fine for me which was the default I think. Remember, you may have to check your firewall or disable it temporarily to do this at your own risk.

After this choose either ISO, or DSF, and dual for stereo or multi for multichannel. Choosing ISO may be best so that you can archive this in case you want the multichannel down the road or if your system or wi-fi is slow. I hooked my OPPO directly to an extra Apple Extreme I was using as an extender using an ethernet cable and it was pretty fast. Originally I had it running upstairs in my theatre room on Oppos WIFI USB stick and it was SLOOOOW.

This is where the Autoscript zip file is.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/8cunli3d3basmix/AAAY2mPDW9QH_so52EwCCBhya?dl=0

After you choose your options, choose Execute. It should start ripping your SACD! Let me know if this is helpful or if you already knew about this. I did not know about this and it has been awesome. I have almost ripped my entire SACD library (I have less than 30) and I have ordered some new SACDs on ebay, elusive disc, and amazon since it costs about the same as buying a DSD or High Res file from HDTracks or some of the others. I just got John Lennon’s Imagine and Double Fantasy, The Doors LA Woman and The Doors album, Bryan Ferry, The Cars, Hall & Oates, Dusty Springfield, and many others on SACD now. I basically got Rock/Pop ones that are hard to find on DSD downloads.

For whatever reason, I prefer the DSD to the 192/24 when I have both. It may be how it was engineered, the masters they used, or just that my setup sounds better for DSD. The direct stream DAC has made listening to regular CDs much more enjoyable again. I am using Red Cloud. I have no desire to try any other firmware since it sounds so great. Great job Ted, Paul and everyone else at PS Audio that contributed to bringing us the DAC.

Hope this is helpful to someone. Hope its not too confusing. I found it to be pretty easy, but I’m a former computer guy turned physician. If you have any questions about it, just post and I’ll see if I can help if it’s in my league.

Dr. Ursus


#2

The link to the above autoscript zip file is for a mac I believe. The instructions have the link for a PC.


#3

I don’t see the 103D listed, is it a go ?


#4

Yes forgot that one


#5

I am in the same boat. Have the Oppo BDP 105 and am seriously considering the DirectStream. The SACD ripping is an option but I would rather have DSD over HDMI like the Bryston BDA-3 so I can keep the Oppo as a transport. Otherwise I would have to also get the PSA memory player which is another 6K!

Is there a reason why PSA went proprietary rather than provide compatibility with existing SACD players?


#6
ayang90@gmail.com said

Is there a reason why PSA went proprietary rather than provide compatibility with existing SACD players?

Sony licensing. As far as DSD between boxes, there is no "compatibility with existing SACD players." You can't have DSD "in the wild" i.e. anywhere available outside a box where it might be recorded. Sony is doing it's best to do what they promised to the music providers - keeping the high resolution data from being digitally copied.

Technically newer HDMI specs provide for encrypted DSD, but the costs for licensing for “video” technologies like HDMI are far too onerous for small companies / products that aren’t mass produced. PS Audio was using I2S over the HDMI hardware long before HDMI supported DSD, even in theory.


#7
ayang90@gmail.com said

I am in the same boat. Have the Oppo BDP 105 and am seriously considering the DirectStream. The SACD ripping is an option but I would rather have DSD over HDMI like the Bryston BDA-3 so I can keep the Oppo as a transport. Otherwise I would have to also get the PSA memory player which is another 6K!

Is there a reason why PSA went proprietary rather than provide compatibility with existing SACD players?

I have the Bryston and did not feel it sounded much better than just using my oppo 105D to play SACD over HDMI. Maybe HDMI is not a good interface for sound? DSD sounded better on the Bryston using USB on my system than playing SACD from the Oppo 105D or 203 using HDMI. I think the DirectStream is a better DAC, even though the Bryston is versatile. I use the BDA-3 on my second system now.

#8
DrUrsus said

I have the Bryston and did not feel it sounded much better than just using my oppo 105D to play SACD over HDMI. Maybe HDMI is not a good interface for sound? DSD sounded better on the Bryston using USB on my system than playing SACD from the Oppo 105D or 203 using HDMI. I think the DirectStream is a better DAC, even though the Bryston is versatile. I use the BDA-3 on my second system now.

Thanks for sharing your experiences with the Bryston. I got off the sidelines today and went for the DirectStream with Bridge II. Ted's thoughtful comments, design philosophy and user comments via this community helped me make my final decision.

Can’t wait to get it in to my system!


#9

Cool beans! You’ll be thrilled when you get it!


#10

Wasn’t there a firmware restriction on the oppos too? Ie they closed the hole with a fireware update like the PS3?


#11

^ The ability to play SACD-Rs was deprecated through f/w updates in the BDP-83/93/95 models. The 103/105 never had that ability but (as of the current f/w) retain the ability to rip SACDs as described by the OP. The current 203/205 models do not allow for either SACD-R play or ripping SACDs.


#12

I kept my firmware updated and it still works. I probably won’t update it anymore since I need it to rip the SACDs and I don’t need anything an updated firmware would add. I just watch movies on it in my projector movie room.

I have been buying and ripping Japanese SHM SACDs. Got some good ones like John Lennon’s Imagine & Double Fantasy, Fleetwood Mac Rumours and Fleetsood Mac album. The DSD sounds better to me than the 192/24 PCM files I have of those. It’s close, but the DSDs sound more real on the DirectStream DAC and my old Mytek Brooklyn DAC.


#13

I don’t think you’ll regret it. The only other DAC I considered that I could fit in my budget (or wanted to spend) (basically $10,000 or less) was the Chord DAVE but that was at least $3000 more even for a used one and quite a bit more for a new one and then I would want the stand lol. With the money I saved I bought a portable Chord Mojo & Mr. Speakers Aeon Flow closed headphones for travel and home when my wife is sleeping. I love that Combo.
If you ever get the chance and want closed headphones, I recommend those 2 products as well.

It’s interesting bc it seems Ted and the Chord guy Watts took 2 entirely different routes in their design of a DAC and they both sound great. It comes down to price, system synergy and preference (I have only heard the DirectStream with Redcloud FYI).
Another FYI, the Chord Mojo sounds good as a headphone DAC but horrible imo as a system DAC even setting output to 3 V with my Parasound JC2 BP pre-amp. Not recommended unless you have a very budget system.


#14

The only bad thing about me discovering this is I keep buying SACDs on eBay, Elusive Disc, Music Direct, and Amazon. Surprised my wife hasn’t said anything to me yet lol! But, it’s been a lot of fun and they sound incredible!

Now, I want to get some great classical or non pop/rock SACDs. I’d appreciate any recommendations since I’ve mostly listened to rock/pop but my tastes have changed. Maybe it’s age and better system idk, but I want better recorded music too.


#15

Fabulous… thanx much! But I have some questions and having issues (the therapy is not helping).

I ripped my SACD of Steely Dan Pretzle Logic… tried both DSS & DSF… both appear to behave and sound the same. But I am having issues… so be patient and help me out here. Thanx so much.

My rig:

  • I am using Windows, Foobar, the oxford comma, and all my files are stored on a NAS. I use my PC/Foobar to play and output via my PC USB port.
  • Files are 44.1 Wavs and now I ripped SACD Steely Dan Pretzel Logic to both DSS, and DSF files
  • I have two USB devices attached (at the same time) for music playback: 1) USB to the Junior’s USB In, 2) USB to my Mutec 1.2, and then XLR to Junior’s XLR in (I use the Mutec to distribute the digital stream to other DACs I have).
  • I downloaded and installed both the Mutec and PS Audio drivers
  • In Foobar, Preferences/Playback/Output, the “Device” driver dropdown shows four options:
    1 - “KS : PS Audio USB Audio 2.0 Output” and
    2 - "DSD : KS : PS Audio USB Audio 2.0 Output"
    3 - “KS : MC-1.2 USB Audio 2.0 Output” and
    4 - “DSD : KS : MC-1.2 USB Audio 2.0 Output”

I received my Junior about 1.5 weeks ago and didn’t rip my SACDs so all I had was my large library of bit-for-bit WAVs (I purchased everything!). Everything worked really well using both PS Audio and Mutec “KS…” drivers. I never tried the “DSD…” drivers. I could switch drivers and then change the input to the Junior (USB direct from computer or XLR from the Mutec) and play through either path. Everything worked fine and still does with WAVs.

Now I ripped Steely Dan SACD using ISO2DSD and all is not so good and some new questions emerged… so here we go:

Question 1 - Which PS Audio Output driver should I use DSD or non-DSD for 44.1 WAVs? (or Mutec if I am going that route)?
(this is a general question for playing only 44.1 WAVs from CDs, and not related to the DSS or DSF file type.)

Both DSD and non-DSD drivers work. The junior display shows “PCM 44.1k 24bit” for each driver. Hmm… which should I choose when playing just 44.1 WAVs … is there a sound difference?

Question 2 - DSS & DFF files will NOT PLAY using the DSD PS Audio driver but WILL PLAY with my DSD Mutec driver - Why?

I can play DSS & DFF files via the PC-USB-Mutec-XLR-Junior path selecting the Mutec “DSD : KS…” driver. They show “DSD64 1 Bit” on the Junior (btw, there is a tiny crackle between songs). I can also play 44.1 WAVs, the Junior shows “PCM 44.1k 24 Bits”.

When I select the “DSD : KS : PS Audio…” driver for the PC-USB-Junior path, I get silence on DSS & DFF files and the Junior display shows “PCM 176.4 24Bits”. It will play 44.1 WAVs with “PCM 44.1k 24bit” in the display.

So what gives with the PS Audio DSD driver not playing DSS and DSF files with the odd display?

Peace
Bruce in Philly


New DS owner, share your experience of the DAC running in from new?
#17

The most likely problem is that you have some volume control not at unity or some DSP going on. There’s a How To that explains how to test for that if you don’t find it quickly: http://www.psaudio.com/ps_how/how-to-run-a-bit-perfect-test-with-directstream/


#18

Thanx Ted, I will give that a try… but I know my Volume slider in Foobar is at 100%… (I keep it hidden for that reason). I did note that the DSD Mutec driver will play though.

I also double checked in that I have no active DSPs installed and Replay Gain is all “none”.

For regular 44.1 WAVs, should I use the DSD driver or non-DSD driver.

Peace
Bruce in Philly


#19

I forgot to answer question 1: if the bitperfect test passes what ever driver you are using is fine. Using the “DSD: ASIO: PS Audio USB Driver” has the least problems in my experience. With ASIO there’s less likelihood that Windows will be mixing in the outputs or other programs, etc.


#20

TED!!! You da man!!! (but you knew that).

I followed your instructions in your link… The PS Audio slider was set at 50 in Windows! The Mutec was at 100. All is good now.

I wonder how it got that way… hmmmm… when I set all this up last week, … for some reason the PS Audio was selected as as my Windows default and therefore took the volume control settings I use for YouTube etc. I remember dicking with it after the install. I have an analog out from my computer’s soundcard that goes to little powered speakers on my desktop so I can hear the computer beeps etc… and play YouTube etc… I don’t use the big stereo rig for “regular” computer use, only for Foobar and my music collection.

Thanx again.

Peace
Bruce in Philly


#21

Oh… I did run the bit-perfect test and I think it passed. A “B” appeared under the lock asterisk… I suspect this is the way it works on a Junior. I ran both the 96 and 192 files and got t he “B” with each.

Thanx so much again.

Peace
Bruce in Philly