Belden ICONOCLAST Interconnects and Speaker Cabling


#946

Hi Brett,

These are true AIR TUBE cables, and yes the tubes make the cables stiffer. I recommend 15X diameter minimum bends (15x 0.320")= 4.8"or about 10 inches diameter. Also, the XLR by their nature require the cable to “twist” some to align the connector to the socket. The twist is absorbed in the LENGTH of the cable, so go too short and that twist can’t be properly relieved into the cable structure. Teflon will “relax” and take a set over time. So future use gets easier but you CANNOT kink the cable! The cables sound so good based on the requirements of the design and a reasonable 1.5 meter length or so.

Race cars are a pain to drive as they are mad to go FAST, not be easy to use. We have a BAV (Belden Audio Video) design of the RCA and XLR that is VERY flexible for studio use. It uses cheaper, more flexible plastics for near the same electricals (Teflon is better) for those that truly need the high FLEXIBILITTY and yet want better sounding cables. The BAV cables us the exact same electromagnetic design. They use a SINGLE wire design so as to be more robust in a studio. They are a self healing air core design that only Belden has.

Galen Gareis


#947

Thank you. I have two pair of cables, 1m and 10ft, on the way and I’m afraid that radius is going to be difficult for my setup to accommodate. I can certainly temporarily make the space but the aesthetic of doing so long term will not be congruent with marital bliss.

Does BJC carry the BAV cable? I currently have the very flexible 1800F but I believe it been outclassed by other upgrades, especially the TPC speaker leads.

How about adding a quality right-angle adaptor? I understand another connector is desirable but in this case it’s got to be better than changing the geometry of the cable.

Brett


#948

We will look into a right angle connector or adaptor. Galen did design the BAV flexible cable and I know we ran some before we left Belden. In fact Galen made a 60’ pair for a customer in VA. I will need to look into this product since it is not really a production product at this time.


#949

Good Morning, Gen 1, SPTPC is the way to go.

Happy New Year!!


#950

Brett,

One meter ICONOCLAST XLR SHOULD allow a 180 bend with adequate space behind the rack. Yes, carefully review the cables fitments upon arrival. If you see deficiencies due to space, we do have an answer for tight installations. Also, a ninety-degree XLR may help where room is tight, eliminating some of the rear clearance.

We may look into ninety-degree XLR for tight back of rack applications but, this will not mitigate the suggested min length to absorb the 180-degree TWIST necessary for polarized XLR connectors.

I am attaching the technical BAV XLR and RCA document for your review. These are VERY flexible for tight spaces and also offer far superior sound quality over any cable Belden has ever made. This design is a SELF HEALING air tube. It will snap back if bent too far…it can not resist a too tight bend, but it CAN recover once the too tight bend is removed. Again, the designs are based on real measurements and physical properties necessary to provide superior cable function. These are not made-up cables, but the make-up does make the sound!

Blue Jeans does have the cable in RCA and XLR.

Galen Gareis

(Attachment PRJTRPT_ICONOCLAST_High Flex XLR.pdf is missing)


#951

Brett,

Send me your direct Email, I’ll forward the tech paper on the BAV XLR and RCA products.

Galen Gareis


#952

Not real happy about the response to questions about the bendiness of the Iconoclast interconnects. The question of whether these products are esoterica for the obsessive fusser comes to mind. Technical verbiage is confounding blather to a layman interested in connecting two devices and sitting down to listen to music.

So, could someone put it into straightforward language? Is a half-circle arc OK? Is more than one bend OK? Am I even asking the right questions? Am I destroying the usefulness of the cable if I violate certain rules? Do I really need this product?


#953

Galen directs not to kink the cable (this should be obvious) and recommends a bend up to 10 inches diameter. See, here, above.

If you have a specific question or concern I suggest giving them a call to discuss it.


#954

I have extra length but maybe this gives you a ballpark.


#955

How much distance do you have between back of equipment and wall?


#956

Hi everyone,

My first post here. I just wanted to share my opinion and how I ended up buying Iconoclast cables. I finally got to the point where I wanted to upgrade my cables, I kept this as a last step to the upgrade progression of my audio system. I visit the PS Audio site because I own a Direct Stream Dac, and that is how I ran across this thread. I was really excited about the reviews of these cables and when I found out that Blue Jeans cable was involved, that for me made it a no brainer, as I have been a Blue Jeans cable customer for many years and have a lot of trust in their business. First, I bought Iconoclast speaker cables and was impressed with the BIG difference it made in my system, that lead me to the ofe xlr cables purchase, again a huge jump in sound quality, it totally transformed my system. I told my wife that my system sounds like the systems at audio shows. Now my listening sessions have turned into marathon listening sessions. Now with the purchase of the speaker cables and the ofe xlr cables, I am going to complete the loom with the purchase of more cables for my home theater set up, that’s how much I am impressed with the Iconolcast cables. I believe these cables will become a must have for demanding audiophiles once more people actually experience them, the change they make is unbelievable. Audition them and be prepared to keep them.


#957

Welcome, Sonic77!


#958

Can’t wait for my long run XLRs to come in- lots going on this year with my system as I have taken on the task of building my own subs/speakers. Will try to post pics of progress. HNY all!


#959

11 inches from equipment to wall.


#960

Depends on the total performance you want. A tube is stiffer than a rod of the same material. No way around that unless you CHANGE the material. Are ICONOCLAST made for a different customer to achieve higher levels of audible performance? There should be zero question that that is the case. Reasonable care is required for all air tube cable, but not excessive.

For those that expect to run a Camry like a race car and expect to, “just get to driving”, it isn’t going to happen. Extreme performance comes with limitations. This is about the physics of the design to reach sound quality standards. That said, people used to driving performance cars won’t see them as unsual in their requirements.

Those that want a more relaxed set of physicals need to consider the BAV Belden audio video material designs for RCA and XLR. Both designs use a self healing air tube design that recovers from improper handling, yet provide still near best in class measured electrical. The plastics used aren’t as high a dielectric standard as FEP, so there are trade offs to achieve flexibility, but with IDENTICAL geometric design, the static measured electrical are near identical. Dynamically, the FEP is best, but the geometry is most important to overall performance so most of the benefits are retained.

The extreme nature of pro studio applications (abuse) of the BAV cable require the use of SINGLE wire design.

So yes, there is a solution for a more agnostic approach to physical performance with the BAV design. There is not a solution for same as a race car that drives like a Camry, however. But, the BAV DESIGN gets really close.

Send me your direct email and I will send you the design proofs on the BAV cable design.

ICONOCLAST are not guesses, and changing the requirements (sound verses ease of use) change the material design. The difference is we are willing to tell you such, and give you the data so you can properly decide what is best for you.

It is natural to want a product that does everything, but that is marketing; cover up the deficiencies and make you think you are getting more. I refuse to market ICONOCLAST like that. If being aware of limitations upset you, maybe you finally have the proper information to buy the right product design. Limitations will always exist.

Galen Gareis


#961

@rower30 Great explanation of an alternative choice. Its easy to learn a lot here just hanging out on the sidelines.Thanks

Do you have a source for the BAV cables with XLR ends?


#962

Thanks for responding to my vituperative complaint. I admit I deserve the condescension in your reply. To extend your automotive metaphor a bit before moving on: The cost of the two pieces of electronics in my simple system, plus speakers, cables, interconnect and mains filter would fetch a well-equipped small BMW—though I actually drive a much humbler vehicle.

Had the Iconoclast site administered by Blue Jeans Cable posted cautions about flexibility and bending, I would not have posted my annoyance. Not every consumer will encounter the advice and lengthy technical explanations you delight in. I don’t think useful information, simply stated is marketing hyperbole

If you read my first post on the Iconoclast thread, you will know that it was an expression of delight and praise for your speaker cables. I will not be returning them to BJC. BobBJC’s response to that post encouraged me to try as an AES interconnect a Generation 1 cable. I have that cable now and like it much more than any AES cable I have used. If I can overcome the anxiety that I have ordered the wrong length and, despite due caution in installation, bent the wrong angle in the wrong direction, thereby damaging the cable’s true potential, I will remain satisfied. I doubt I will return this Iconoclast interconnect. In that BJC offer unconditional return privilege, I have little to complain about.

So let’s leave it there. Thank you for developing superb products, and best wishes for the New Year.


#963

@devfitz Perhaps your cautionary advice about bending will be addressed on the BJC Iconoclast pages. Hey, we all get grouchy from time to time. I appreciate that you expressed yourself clearly, honestly and with consideration for the others on this site.


#964

Good Morning,

You may order the BAV, XLR cables from BJC under part number PDC3284 (BAV Flexible.) For now a custom quote will need to be prepared based on length. If you are interested please send me a message with your contact information and cell number.

Keep in mind, this product was originally developed for the studio, commercial AV, roadshow, pre and post-post production facilities and anywhere constant deployment/retrieval is necessary. After Galen did the final design and ran a batch he was kind enough to send me a 4’ piece. I was truly amazed as when the cable came out of the box it felt like a wet noodle. But, at the same time was as tough as nails. The mechanical design provides significantly increased performance over any other AES/EBU balanced designs available to the market. If Belden will market the product it will take over the segment. Belden doesn’t understand what they have.

As good as it is, and it is very, very good, it is still not Iconoclast. It solves problems and fills a vast need for a this type of product. It’s also a lot less cost than Iconoclast. I know Galen sent a sample to PS Audio and they were very impressed.


#965

@BobBJC I sen you a message (I think). Let me know if you got it ok.
Thanks