DSD over Bridge II from network computer?


#1

Don’t get me wrong…I love my PS Audio gear, which I have consistently and continuously upgraded, but it’s pretty frustrating to have to get an entire technical education when you just want to play some music!

If I had my music on a laptop or HD connected to a laptop, and connected its USB output to the DS, I know what I would have to do to play DSD and how I would configure JRiver. Unfortunately, neither JRiver nor PS Audio has seen fit to develop and update detailed instructions on how to make their gear operate in most common environments.

As I understand it, when JRiver sends music from my Win 10 computer over the network you cannot use the “Audio Device” options which allow you to conveniently set up DSD bitstreaming. Instead, the Bridge II shows up under the Media Network options, which do not have the same options. When I steam my Native DSD (.dsf) files from JRiver, the DC shows “PCM 176.K 16 bits.” The music sounds great, but I assume that this is because it was a great recording to begin with and because JRiver does a good job of converting DSD to PCM, and that it would likely improve further if I could play DSD as DSD.

Until I figure this out, I have no reason to spend any more big $$ for native DSD files…Any help would be greatly appreciated.


#2

Select “Bitstream DSD (requires DoPE compliant renderer)” under Tools > Options > Media Network > Add or configure DLNA servers > Advanced. This setting probably solves your issue. DoPE = DSD over PCM Ethernet. This setting results in DSD files being packaged as a PCM file (with no conversion). Your DS should indicate “Input: DOP” and “Rate: DSD” on the display.


#3
Wybe said Select "Bitstream DSD (requires DoPE compliant renderer)" under Tools > Options > Media Network > Add or configure DLNA servers > Advanced. This setting probably solves your issue. DoPE = DSD over PCM Ethernet. This setting results in DSD files being packaged as a PCM file (with no conversion). Your DS should indicate "Input: DOP" and "Rate: DSD" on the display.
Thanks, Wybe, that worked for me. I also went into the DSP Studio settings on the Media Network page and set it to down convert PCM 352 to 176 and 384 to 192 so the Bridge II will handle my higher rez PCM files,as it is limited to 192 for PCM. Also a reminder that DS DAC is limited to DSD single rate, so you need to avoid or convert any double rate DSD files you may have.

Another question, I have another networked DAC on my home LAN. It can handle higher rez PCM files, so is there a way for me to create another DLNA player and have different DSP Studio settings associated with it? If so, how does JRiver know which of these profiles to use? In other words, is there a way to associate the the DLNA profile you create in the Tools>Options>Media Network are with various Players that show up on the left of the home screen in JRiver?


#4

One clarification - there’s a difference between what the bridges support and what the DS supports. The DS also supports 352.8k PCM and double rate DSD, but not all of it’s interfaces do. USB and I2S inputs support PCM sample rates from 22.05k to 352.8k and single and double rate DSD; AES/EBU, S/PDIF only have the bandwidth for up to 192k PCM and single rate DSD, TOSLink may do 176.4k and/or 192k PCM (and hence single rate DSD) but is only speced to do up to 96k PCM. The bridge is limited by the processor speed and other things to 192k and single rate DSD.

JRiver does support multiple DLNA renderers and they can be separately configured. It also has the concept of Zones which can be used to configure different settings for different players (and I believe can have separate DSP settings), but I don’t use them so I don’t know they interact with different DLNA renderers.


#5

Aha! Part of the problem is that I do not find that recommended option. Here is all I see when I try to set advanced options for DLNA Servers…(if you can see this screen shot). Where am I going wrong??

JRiver-Screenshot.jpg


#6

There is more than once “Advanced” in that screen. Ironically you want the one under “Video”, tho those aren’t video advanced features it does a great job of hiding them from the people that care about audio.


#7

Success! Have now played “DoP” tracks. That seems diabolically obscure…why on earth would they set it up that way??

Now my only issue is not being able to play quad DSD files (or DSD 256), since changing the Output Encoding settings in DSP Studio to “4xDSD in DoP format” does not do it. Maybe I need to go back to NativeDSD and download the DSD 64 files (at no extra cost) and just settle for those???


#8
trey said That seems diabolically obscure...........why on earth would they set it up that way??
Things are different on their planet.

#9
Ted Smith said JRiver does support multiple DLNA renderers and they can be separately configured. It also has the concept of Zones which can be used to configure different settings for different players (and I believe can have separate DSP settings), but I don't use them so I don't know they interact with different DLNA renderers.
All true, Ted. Unfortunately, the DSP Studio settings for DLNA Servers don't all work. One of the ones that doesn't is changing the Sample Rate. The only way to down sample a DXD file to send it to the DS DAC is to use the Sample Rate setting under Advanced and manually set it to 176 or 192. Then if you switch back to a 441. file, you need to manually go back in and change it to original or MC will upsample the file to whatever sample rate you have chosen. It's a known bug in JRiver. You can use DSP Studio for EQ apparently but not for changing the Sample Rate. Not clear whether Convolution will work or not.

#10
trey said Now my only issue is not being able to play quad DSD files (or DSD 256), since changing the Output Encoding settings in DSP Studio to "4xDSD in DoP format" does not do it. Maybe I need to go back to NativeDSD and download the DSD 64 files (at no extra cost) and just settle for those???????
The Bridge plays only single-rate DSD.

#11

Understood. And there’s no good or useful way to have JRiver downsample it?


#12

JRiver users (of whom I am not one) will have to jump in on that one.


#13

Ypu can down or upsample in jriver it’s pretty easy , again it’s cmfusing till,you do it. It’s in the dsp studio. Middle of the screen when it’s open. You can opt to down sample anything above 64 or even all to DSd 64.


#14
trey said Understood. And there's no good or useful way to have JRiver downsample it?
Not that I've found. Currently, all you can do is manually set the PCM sample rate but I've tried setting it to 176.4 and streaming a double rate DSD using DLNA to my DAC and it doesn't work. I can play single rate fine and I can downsample DXD files to 176 or 192 but nothing seems to work with double rate DSD.

Karl


#15
1234 said Ypu can down or upsample in jriver it's pretty easy , again it's cmfusing till,you do it. It's in the dsp studio. Middle of the screen when it's open. You can opt to down sample anything above 64 or even all to DSd 64.
Unfortunately, DSP Studio doesn't work for DLNA streaming. It's there under Advanced options but it won't do any down sampling, as I explained above.

#16

Il. Try it now.


#17

Ok I just ride it. Up,or down is only local meaning it’s USB not streaming. It plays DSd 128 but it shows on the DS as 176. I would put up a post on jriver as they are experts . But I did try it Ina few ways and it Ed not work. Ted weigh in here if you can. But it does play DSd 64 and displays as such. So I guess the bridge must be doing something to let jriver know , I think. But atleast it plays the files my 40 k msb will not play it at all period lol.

And as you stated its not in dsp but dlna . I did try dsp first lol. I can say that the bridge 2 is close to the USB and there really is no big change in sound using the bridge 2 and it on the fly going to 176. As frt buying formats I would still buy the DSd 128 over 64. Ona good setup the I provemet is there for sure.


#18

The bridgeII does not support DSD128.

Dennis