Seegs108 said…Unfortunately, getting his Ph.D. in electrical engineering probably didn’t teach him that. I’m not sure how having one applies to this conversation, but it was nice of him to mention that he has one.
Seegs108 saidSound signature is very personal. I agree Huron sounded a little more laid back. You may prefer that sound. I prefer the more forward and seemingly more detailed sound that Red Cloud brings to the table.
@brodric Sorry, I don’t agree. Just because you have a degree (or some intelligence) doesn’t mean that you know about some small technicality in that Disk Utility doesn’t format to FAT16. I’ve worked with enough engineers in my life to know that the ones who throw the fact that they have an engineering degree in your face are usually using it as some kind of an excuse as to why something else is the problem and not them. “I have an engineering degree, so obviously if I can’t figure it out it’s flawed.” This is the kind of mentality I’ve dealt with a lot with many engineers over the years. I’m not saying there aren’t people with legitimate issues upgrading firmware, but having a degree means literally nothing in the way of upgrading a firmware via an SD Card and I find the claim saying otherwise laughable and honestly a bit rude questioning the intelligence of anyone without an engineering degree.
I do not even play an engineer on TV.
lonson saidI pondered Ted/s words about RedCloud’s “magic” possibly being slightly diminished when output is at 100 percent and as I am using my preamp I have backed the DSD output to about 80 percent and think there is a slightly better sound that way. I like RedCloud more and more as I use it more.
Have others noticed this?
ihmeyers said…“I don’t recall Ted saying this; I probably missed the post.”
Ted Smith quote…
“In general there are certainly some systems where listening to the DS or DS Jr at some level less than 100 might sound better. In those cases something else in the chain may be distorting at higher levels. This isn’t very likely in that the DS and DS Jr have a maximum output level that’s a little lower than average for DACs.
Redcloud is the first release of software for the DS and DS Jr that has a possible technical reason that listening below 100 might be better than at 100. 1st off there’s a bug where very loud music at very high levels might crackle at the peaks. Ignoring that: The parts of signals that reach above -9dBFS (82 on the volume control IF the music were reaching full scale) are more like Huron than the lower level parts of signals. So depending on your source material and it’s typical levels, some volume below 100 may sound a little better if your external preamp is making up the difference in the volume well and you don’t have any hiss from the DS because the volume is too low for the rest of your system. You do lose a little S/N with volumes less than 100, but that may be less of an issue than losing the “Redcloud goodness” with levels near full scale. I hope to remove the level restriction on a future release, but we’ll have to see how my ideas pan out.”
Elk saidI do not even play an engineer on TV.
MattC said@brodricj
I’m sorry to hear you’re having a hard time with the upgrade on your DSj. Can I ask what FW versions are displayed on your version menu? I’d like to help you get this resolved so you can upgrade to Redcloud and also not have any problems with future updates.
Regards,
Matt
I have completed redcloude update from huron.
I notice that the redcloude and Main versions are different, do you have an explanation?
thx rudi
Okay I did some further playing about with the gain between all my components and I think the differences I was hearing between the DSD at 100 and 80 are more related to the differing output from my ZTPRE preamp and other Decware components than the DSD output settings. I have an interesting situation in my system’s adjustability. The DSD has a digital preamp, and I’m using the balanced output into my ZTPRE preamp which can output (via adjustable stepped attenuators) more than 30 volts. I am using a Decware ZBIT balanced to single-ended transformer which allows me to transfer all the volts from the ZTPRE to a single-ended component, and the ZBIT also has dual stepped attenuators to adjust it’s output. I am running the single-ended from the ZBIT into a Decware ZROCK2 which is an interesting EQ device that I find very effective and surprisingly transparent and which has allowed me to fine tune the sound to just what I want to hear as source material varies, and which also adds some gain (and is by-passable). And then from there single-ended into my amplifier, which also has a stepped attenuator adjusted input gain. So you can imagine I can futz about “riding the gain” all day if I get myself in that sort of mood.
So today I restored output from the DSD to 100 and played about and have excellent sound that also alleviates a bit of the forwardness of RedCloud that is my one niggling complaint about its “sound.” With the gains set this way and using the remote volume adjustment of the ZTPRE I’m in heaven for both audio and video sound reproduction today. Now I just have to leave things alone! 
rdegaud said
I have completed redcloude update from huron.
I notice that the redcloude and Main versions are different, do you have an explanation?thx rudi
lonson saidNow I just have to leave things alone!
I upgraded my DS to Redcloud the evening before last. All I did was put the included 8GB SD card into my Mac, download the folder from PS Audio’s website, drag the folder to the card then follow the upgrade video. I did no formatting of the SD card that I have seen others talk about in this thread. Upgrade took around 3 minutes at a guess. Then I just powered the DS up and enjoyed myself 
I should preface the following with the fact that my system and room are still “under construction” and are not optimized. Having said that the differences between Redcloud and Huron were very easy to hear. I listened to a disc I am very familiar with immediately before and after the upgrade. The sound in my room became more forward, transparency increased and the soundstage became a foot taller at the bottom and the top.
Welcome!
Very good to hear. It fascinates me that the soundstage can be vertical when a system is performing well.
There was no need to format the card as you used the card which came with the unit; it is already formatted.
Jeff of Arabica saidI'll make you a deal: whichever of us can find that magic trick will reveal to the other!Good luck with that Lon! When you unlock the mysteries of that elusive skill, please do share
I haven’t found it yet. . . seeing as I’ve changed amps since that post!
Ted Smith quote...“In general there are certainly some systems where listening to the DS or DS Jr at some level less than 100 might sound better. In those cases something else in the chain may be distorting at higher levels. This isn’t very likely in that the DS and DS Jr have a maximum output level that’s a little lower than average for DACs.
Ted Smith quote... Redcloud is the first release of software for the DS and DS Jr that has a possible technical reason that listening below 100 might be better than at 100. 1st off there’s a bug where very loud music at very high levels might crackle at the peaks. Ignoring that: The parts of signals that reach above -9dBFS (82 on the volume control IF the music were reaching full scale)OK, I'm about to lose my $#!7 - I was hearing some crackle at the peaks, and I thought I was having an input tube issue, swapped tubes and even swapped amps! Then I thought maybe it was a tweeter issue on my reference speakers, so I switched to a different speaker setup with a smoother more forgiving tweeter. When I heard the distortion again I thought I was imagining the distortion. I think I even mentioned it in my first post about RedCloud, how I have to trace back some treble distortion. Grrr
Redcloud is the first release of software for the DS and DS Jr that has a possible technical reason that listening below 100 might be better than at 100. 1st off there’s a bug where very loud music at very high levels might crackle at the peaks. Ignoring that: The parts of signals that reach above -9dBFS (82 on the volume control IF the music were reaching full scale)
Crud. I’ve heard that. It got me running at Attenuation “in” vs. out and looking for a pre-amp. I thought I was just running too high a digital / hi-resolution signal to my speakers (DSD jr to M700s) and cracking them up at volume. It showed up bad on a pair of hi end bookshelves.
Here a great micro review of the DMP and DSDAC as an excerpt of Jim Smith‘s latest newsletter + a Copper mention:
PS Audio Direct Stream DAC & Memory Player -
PS audio’s Bill Leebens (another top class audio guy), recently sent me the PS Audio Direct Stream DAC & Memory Player to audition. Hey Bill, finders keepers!!! 
Having heard and worked with some of the top digital gear out there - including rigs that sell in the six figure price range - over 10 times the PS Audio’s price(!) - the PS Audio combo easily holds its own. Honestly speaking, the performance difference between the PSA and many other much higher priced set-ups is not that great, and in some cases, the PSA is better, IMO.
Then, add in the FREE updates - that you can easily do yourself - and it’s a relative no-brainer.
And did I say that it is imminently involving musically?
No Copper articles for a while – until TTSB is competed.
As mentioned above - and in the accompanying Breaking Through podcast - I have abstained from further contributions to Copper e-mag until the TTSB project is completed. This is a great - and free - bi-weekly magazine about audio, music, and much more. The 50th issue is available now. http://www.psaudio.com/issue/issue-50/
OH WELL…
”LAS VEGAS, Jan. 3, 2018 /PRNewswire/ — Qobuz, a European commercial online music streaming and downloading service, announced today its high-end system will be available in the United States beginning in mid-2018. Qobuz is the highest resolution music streaming service in the world, providing users with the most in-depth and interactive music experience possible. It offers an extensive music catalog of 40-million tracks and is the only service to offer over one-million high-resolution tracks. Qobuz works on Mac/iOS/Android/Windows operating systems, and is integrated with all of the most prestigious Hi-Fi brands.
“We are absolutely thrilled with the idea of offering American music lovers our extraordinary online music service,” stated Denis Thébaud, Qobuz president. “Our team is made up of dedicated, knowledgeable discographers, who, day after day, sift through our catalogue, to bring the past to life and to discover new great talent. They help our users unearth discoveries in all musical genres. Qobuz is a specialist in all genres. We look forward to bringing our service to the American audiophile.”
Seeking some advice.
I am hearing some “tick” sound randomly during songs, especially DSD. Do I have a problem?
sdwong saidSee last paragraph in http://www.psaudio.com/forum/directstream-all-about-it/fpga-improvements-in-redcloud/page-11/#p84208Seeking some advice.
I am hearing some “tick” sound randomly during songs, especially DSD. Do I have a problem?
http://www.psaudio.com/forum/directstream-all-about-it/fpga-improvements-in-redcloud/page-12/#p85675
I looked for my overview post but I couldn’t find it.
There are two known possible problems in Redcloud and the contemporaneous bridge software updates relating to ticks within a playing DSD track.
There’s a problem with (some of?) the bridge releases that cause ticks in DSD (at any level.) I know PS Audio is working with the bridge software company on this but I don’t know the current state.
There’s a bug in Redcloud that can cause ticks (or worse, blurbles, ) in any file if it’s loud enough. Since DSD can technically reach about 4dB louder than PCM (tho on average it should be the same) it’s seen a lot more in DSD files. Anyway you can test to see if you are encountering this bug by turning the volume down a few ticks, this bug will result in differing numbers of ticks and or a change in the character of ticks with each lowering of the volume. In all probability when you get to, say, 90 the problem is gone for most files (but not all.) The only work around at this point is to lower the volume until the problem doesn’t bother you anymore. Note that the problem isn’t volume control related but is related to the short term level of the final DSD signal sent out of the FPGA.