It may be a faulty “load,” I’ll see how it sounds tomorrow. I don’t believe it’s my speakers, which do have an omnidirectional driver at the top, a conventional front-firing driver and ribbon tweeter on the front top face and a passive radiator at the bottom (see photo).
I’ve had updates that took a few reboots to sound their best before, and I did both the DMP and the DSD updates at once, which is a big batch of changes. I may end up loving it, but I definitely haven’t had the same immediate reaction others have. (But then I’m used to being different).
Nope. Lon, there must be something not aligning somewhere. I can’t imagine Snowflake being described as “fatiguing”, It has a maliflous , engaging sound; smooth and quite beautiful compared to others.
Mayhaps it’s just not happy with Uncle Steve’s amps?
I don’t think it’s anything in the system, I’ll see how it sounds again tomorrow. As I said I’ve had to reboot several times with other updates. And it may be the 3.10 change as well. My system wouldn’t suddenly react differently.
perhaps my own experience will help those who aren’t enjoying Snowmass. From past experience I know that upgrading to a new OS requires about 200 hours of “break in,” similar to breaking in new equipment, for my DS in my system. If that sounds strange to folks who load it and the full sound is there, well it is, but others have similar experience (with perhaps needing fewer hours).
Previously, I thought the bad sound was a bad load, but the OS showed correctly on the screen and reloading didn’t help. Only extended time playing music helped. Just at with new equipment, after a few hours I could hear the promise of the new system. Then it got bad. I’ve never heard my system sounds worse than with Snowmass in the early going. Like broken glass and the highs were terrible.
The DS would cycle through good hours – either really enormous soundstage or gorgeous sound – then back to the bad stuff. After about 150 hours, most of the qualities were there. Then there is usually a long process of the last edges getting sanded down (or like wine breathing and becoming less acidic).
Running it in over night is painless and speeds up the process. Hang in there.
Ok under Bridge it says None. Where do I get the latest firmware for Bridge 2? All I see is Bridge Update 2.15 (Bridge 1 only) in the archives tab. My bridge says “PS Audio Bridge II” and below that “Perfectwave Bridge”.
Yes, no doubt about the phase difference is present…
This speaks beyond the phase/ultrasonics…
very revealing of even the small(est) details…But, it’s more about the presentation…voices are thin and kinda tinny…and have a higher pitch…
and, at starting at the midrange frequencies, the “music” is blaring/glaring/shrill…fatiguing as such…and the face forward projection, kinda takes away from the depth….
Bass is good/fine…soundstage nice…
I learned a long time ago from Dave Sales @ Mark Levinson that being flat accurately is not necessarily the best in sound…I had a 3rd octave White equalizer (at time, the recording industry favorite) with 27 frequency bands per channel…I had it professionally done with a HP analyzer to as flat as possible…and yet, when Dave strongly suggested/hinted that I bypass said EQ, wiring straight between components and…and…
I sold the EQ pair the next day…being tri-amped, I only adjusted at a range of connected frequencies…somehow this was great…still do the same with my “renovated” system at my next abode…so much more musical, without fatigue.
After a 3 day burn in, I did the gambit with installing the upgrade and always the same…on Both of my DS DAC’s with the same results.
I think you are extremely talented; but this update makes me think you were being pushed hard to produce on a rushed time schedule…stifling your creative processes…
funny part is that on day 2, the update sounded better than day 3, when it became shrill and stayed
Ok. I hooked up my DSD for the first time via ethernet the connection icon is greeen and at first it said the firmware was up to date but in the Bridge ver it said 0.0.0. I rebooted the DAC and now it says ver 1.2.1 and still says the firmware is up to date. I see no update icon like it does in the video. I hit reset bridge in the set up and that didn’t do anything.
What do i do to get it updated?
This can’t be anything to do with the DAC, the pitch is controlled by the source, e.g. the speed of the samples. There’s no code or hardware in the DS that changes pitch.
No, there are vanishingly few who are having any sound quality issues at all. Many fewer than in any previous release.
There’s something else going on in your system, whether it’s a bad download (not likely), a failed update (unlikely since I expect you’ve installed Snowmass and gone back to Redcloud multiple time), etc. or some hardware incompatibility isn’t obvious.
I don’t have a good idea what components you have in your system but it’s probable that there’s some interaction between one of the components you are using and the DS and that the things that are different in your system from most systems might be a hint as to what’s going on.
Just as an example, if you were using the I2S inputs and the clock was out of polarity, then exactly where the clock transitions vs the data transitioning could cause varying results from release to release of the DS (just like it work for a hardware I2S receiver). For valid I2S clocks and data all releases will give the same result, but if, say, the clock is inverted small changes in timing (e.g. how long the system’s been on) can take a system from working fine to one that receiving a lot of hash. There’s no checksum in I2S so no I2S receiver can tell if the data is changing as the clock is changing.
There could be other ways a system could be DS software release sensitive, but with out knowing more about your system and or doing more controlled experiments we can’t tell what’s going on.
If you haven’t already turn the DS off by the back switch and leave it off. Reboot your network and then when it is completely re-booted turn the DS back on. Then if the Bridge registers go to Mcontrol and do the update through it.
I noticed the same initial thinness and ambiguity after installing Snowmass. Within seconds, I was fiddling with the DS touchscreen display and saw my “Phase” setting was OUT instead of IN.
Restoring it to IN was all it took for me to appreciate your great work on Snowmass, @tedsmith.
Nothing in that quote is in contradiction to what I wrote.
I’m not trying to be abrasive, but you are complaining, insulting and aren’t willing to work with me to see what’s going on. You must admit that it’s just as likely to be a system synergy thing as broken DS software since you are the only one (or one of a few) with such a complaint. The logic you are using just as well could says that something is broken in your system. I’m trying to be logical and narrow things down before jumping to conclusions and pointing blame. Instead I’d like to figure out where to look.
What’s your system like - and in particular is it, say source/DAC/{optional preamp}/amp/speakers or is there something else going on? If there is something else going on, as an experiment can you simplify your system and see if you still get the same Snowmass Redcloud differences?
For me, that is an awesome use of the DS LCD display.
To be honest, I enjoy the improved sound quality from the work of @tedsmith that I don’t really mind the issues with LCD display. Everything I mentioned previously is simply my “wish list” for something better to come in the future.
For what it’s worth, I found the same as you did when i first installed Snowmass - it was sibilant in the treble.
I didn’t chime in here as it was so different from what others found that I didn’t want to be contrary.
But at the same time I have been breaking in a Furutech GTX D Rhodium NCF outlet which can be bright in the treble too. I played around with warmer power cords.
After a couple of listening sessions, the treble issue went away and I was able to switch back to the normal power cords I use. Hopefully it stays that way with mine and yours goes away too. Whether it’s the outlet, the new firmware or my ears breaking in. I don’t know.
There is more air with Snowmass and the soundstaging at least in my system conveys more of the venue rather than bringing the performance to my room. Enjoyable as it is, it isn’t as dramatic a difference to Redcloud as others have found. Changing the outlet from Furutech GTX D Gold to GTX D Rhodium NCF brought about a bigger sonic change in the same direction.
I find this with each of the previous releases I have upgraded to. They sound brittle and light in bass, this one sounds particularly sibilancy with tape hiss being much more obvious and prominent. When playing Beatles stuff the tambourines are way out front.
I usually stamp my feet and throw out my toys for about a month, then, either something changes, or I get used to it, and I think, hang on, this actually sounds good. I hope the same happens this time.
I have a bad head cold at the moment anyway so can’t hear anything at the mo anyway so I’ll hang on in before reverting back to Red.
Thanks for weighing in. I do know about breaking in plugs, and I did break in a gold Furutech a few weeks previously, and don’t think that’s a factor now as it went through its changes while playing RedCloud.
I’ll reboot again today and listen and report back. I’m beginning to think I had a bad load. The sound is the same via I2S and AES/EBU with the DMP, and come to think of it I didn’t play the other inputs much, it may be the DMP firmware load that was the culprit, I’'ll be sure to reboot both units.
